Why no Goodson-Todman shows on NBC from 1969-78

[chrispw1]

I was wondering why no Goodson-Todman shows were aired on NBC for over eight years from the original Match Game's cancelation in 1969 to the debut of Card Sharks in early 1978, was it Goodson not wanting to do business with NBC as there weren't any Goodson shows on NBC during Lin Bolen's tenure or prefering to do buisness with CBS or ABC?

[Jimmy Owen]

I don't know the answer, but it probably should be noted that HSSS, TTTT and WML all taped at NBC NY in that time frame and the O&O's carried a good number of the syndicated Goodson shows.  KNBC had Wood BTC, TTTT, James TPIR and Dawson Feud and WNBC had the latter three plus Narz Concentration.

[Chelsea Thrasher]

Somehow, I would not be even remotely surprised if this had something to do with Lin Bolen.

[Ian Wallis]

I think it might have something to do with the fact that NBC's schedule was dominated by Heatter-Quigley games during that time.  Maybe there just wasn't any room for a GT show until Card Sharks; or maybe they just didn't feel any of the shows they were pitched were strong enough.  

(That didn't seem to be an issue with Mindreaders though, did it?)

[chris319]

I don't know the story myself, but it is entirely possible that Lin Bolen considered G-T shows to be generally too staid and old-school for NBC.

[SRIV94]

[quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' post=\'175398\' date=\'Jan 18 2008, 11:14 AM\']
I think it might have something to do with the fact that NBC's schedule was dominated by Heatter-Quigley games during that time.  Maybe there just wasn't any room for a GT show until Card Sharks; or maybe they just didn't feel any of the shows they were pitched were strong enough.  
[/quote]
I think between you and Chris you hit the nail on the head.

Consider this--GONG, which debuted four weeks before FF did, was originally pitched to ABC.  Had ABC taken the show, ABC would have had to shove something else aside to make room for FF.  It's plausible that FF could have ended up on NBC in that case if ABC didn't want to cancel anything else, and that was just short of two years before CS debuted.

Refresh my memory on the timing--I'm gathering that when GONG premiered in June 1976, Lin Bolen was no longer with NBC (since she and Barris didn't exactly get along).  So the two-year gap could just have been a coincidence--that NBC didn't have slots open when G/T had projects to pitch, or they weren't overwhelmed enough by the projects for NBC to shove something aside.

[BrandonFG]

[quote name=\'SRIV94\' post=\'175412\' date=\'Jan 18 2008, 01:22 PM\']
Refresh my memory on the timing--I'm gathering that when GONG premiered in June 1976, Lin Bolen was no longer with NBC (since she and Barris didn't exactly get along).  
[/quote]
Her show "Stumpers" debuted in October of that year. I'm guessing she left in '77 at the earliest. However, Barris very well could've had something to do with it though.

[rigsby]

I thought Stumpers was NBC's parting gift to Ms. Bolen as a term of her departure, meaning she'd already been shown the door at that point.

[tpirfan28]

Wouldn't surprise me if Bolen's involvement with NBC had anything to do with it...Match Game ended earlier (and even if it got canned after the risque questions made it on, it'd be too "touchy" for her) and a game like Double Dare seems too cerebral for her.  NBC probably could have gotten Family Feud if she hadn't been so hard-nosed about the others earlier.

[BrandonFG]

[quote name=\'rigsby\' post=\'175423\' date=\'Jan 18 2008, 02:11 PM\']
I thought Stumpers was NBC's parting gift to Ms. Bolen as a term of her departure, meaning she'd already been shown the door at that point.
[/quote]
Interesting. Now I wonder if NBC only intended for the show to last 13 weeks just to shut Lin up...anyone remember how the ratings looked for the show, or what it aired up against?

ETA: 11:30 am, taking HSq's former slot.

[chris319]

It's also possible that G-T was going to CBS with new concepts first, and that Bud Grant/Mike Ogiens were picking them up, thus no reason to deal with NBC. Someone remind us when Bud Grant/Mike Ogiens were in.

Of course that all changed when Fred Silverman came to NBC.

[uncamark]

[quote name=\'chris319\' post=\'175433\' date=\'Jan 18 2008, 02:44 PM\']
It's also possible that G-T was going to CBS with new concepts first, and that Bud Grant/Mike Ogiens were picking them up, thus no reason to deal with NBC. Someone remind us when Bud Grant/Mike Ogiens were in.[/quote]

Early 70s.  By 1972 for sure, when they wanted to dump those expensive morning sitcom reruns that were itching to go to syndication anyway.

[chris319]

No, when did Grant get booted up to president of CBS entertainment and Ogiens take over daytime? We know Grant was doing daytime in 1972.

Morning sitcom reruns expensive? More expensive than making new episodes of game shows and all of the attendant development and pilot costs? Please fill me in on the economics, bearing in mind that in the mid-'80s the typical network daytime game show cost the networks around $120,000 per week. It was enough to make wealthy men out of guys like Frank Wayne, Marc Breslow and Paul Alter (although Goodson got more for his shows than other packagers, and the nighttime versions of those shows made them even wealthier).

[Jimmy Owen]

From pg. 488 of Wesley Hyatt's book "The Encyclopedia of Daytime Television": "In an article in Variety that appeared on October 29, 1969, CBS executives announced that the network had lost interest in nighttime TV show reruns because contracts to repeat such programs as "Here's Lucy," "Gomer Pyle" and "Family Affair" were long-term deals that cost approximately $5 million per show if five years worth of episodes were to be repeated."

[Dbacksfan12]

[quote name=\'chris319\' post=\'175447\' date=\'Jan 18 2008, 06:20 PM\']
No, when did Grant get booted up to president of CBS entertainment and Ogiens take over daytime? We know Grant was doing daytime in 1972.[/quote]To close it up a little bit, Ogiens was in place by 1977, per Curt's website.