Powerhouse shows before Wheel and Jeopardy!

[PYLdude]

And the NBC O&O's had a group deal for Feud, in the same way that the ABC O&O's have a group deal for WoF and J!.  (In the early '80s, the "standard" NBC O&O weeknight schedule was Feud at 7:00 and a syndicated first-run sitcom at 7:30.)

Are you sure about that? I seem to remember Feud airing at 7:30 for the entire time it was on our NBC O&O (which also aired the first two seasons of the Combs syndie series (I think- The Challengers was the game show that replaced it) before dumping it off on our now-MyNetwork affiliate.

And now that I think about it...are all ABC O&O's airing the Merv Griffin power duo? And if so, when did they start airing together (I don't remember)? I know Wheel was sold to a lot of CBS' stations and I think all the O&O's had it until 1989 or 1990.

I know in Chicago, they don't air together- as far back as I can remember, Jeopardy was on at 3:30 and Wheel came on at 6:30.

But they air on the same channel, so they're together. (Jeopardy! still airs on WLS at 3:30- I think the only ABC O&O that still airs it in the afternoon- which, BTW, I think is a better time for it to air, don't ask me why.)

[PYLdude]

Are you sure about that? I seem to remember Feud airing at 7:30 for the entire time it was on our NBC O&O...

Sorry, you might be right -- might have been sitcoms at 7:00 and "Feud" at 7:30.  (Which doesn't make quite as much sense to me as having the sitcoms at 7:30 to lead into NBC prime time, but then, I wasn't a programming director for an NBC O&O in the early '80s.)

I think it would have had to been NBC Nightly News at 7, then Feud. All three of the big three were still airing an hour of news at 6- as a matter of fact, once Jeopardy! moved to 7 PM in '87 (I don't know specifically when- I know that it started '86 in the afternoon and got paired with Sale and Card Sharks, moved to the morning once CS got jettisoned to overnight and was paired with Split Second for awhile after Oprah got the slot), I'm fairly certain that it didn't take long for the other two Big affiliates to cut back their news. I know WCBS still aired Dan Rather before Wheel for a little while (I think in the fall, they picked up WLOD to fill the slot), but I couldn't tell you either a) when WNBC did it or b) what aired at 7 afterwards. (Maybe Inside Edition- they were the first channel in the area to pick it up- or COPS reruns.)

[TimK2003]

I'm not exactly sure what the ratings were for this early-70's duo, but a lot of stations would have paired off the syndicated "To Tell The Truth" with "What's My Line" (or vice-versa).

[Jimmy Owen]

I'm not exactly sure what the ratings were for this early-70's duo, but a lot of stations would have paired off the syndicated "To Tell The Truth" with "What's My Line" (or vice-versa).

Channel 13 in Grand Rapids had "An Hour of Truth," Barker TorC followed by Moore TTTT.

[aaron sica]

I like to tell people that JW and TTD were the Wheel and J! of the late '70s and early '80s, but I've come to realize that this is really not the case. In a lot of markets the two shows rarely aired back-to-back. WHP-TV in Harrisburg ran TTD at 7pm (beginning in 1980, when it came over from WGAL-8, which opted for a 7pm newscast instead), and JW at 7:30 but that didn't even last two years. They are the only market I've seen that aired the two shows back-to-back in the prime access hour.

[RMF]

My understanding is that Let's Make A Deal and Hollywood Squares were in neck-and-neck competition for ratings in the early and mid-1970s, but I've never seen the ratings data to prove it.

I've seen that as well. I used to check out the World Almanacs; each issue has a list of the previous season's top syndicated shows.

Sorry to bump this, but I've checked the World Almanacs, and think the data within may be of interest.

From what I can tell, the earliest World Almanac to have syndication ratings was the 1978 Almanac, including ratings from 1976.

Syndication ratings, from the 1978, 1979, and 1980 Almanacs (game shows in bold):

October-December 1976 (pgs.422-423):

Lawrence Welk- 16.2%
Hollywood Squares- 15.0%
Hee Haw- 14.9%
Name That Tune- 14.2%
Match Game PM- 14.1%
Price Is Right- 13.9%
Candid Camera- 13.8%
Wild Kingdom- 13.7%
$25,000 Pyramid- 13.4%
Muppets- 13.2%
Truth Or Consequences-12.7%
Gong Show- 12.5%
Jacques Costeau- 11.8%
$128,000 Question- 11.5%

October-December 1977 (p.426):

Lawrence Welk- 14.8%
Hee Haw- 14.5%
Muppets- 14.0%
Name That Tune- 13.9%
Price Is Right- 13.8%
Match Game PM- 13.7%
Hollywood Squares- 13.5%
Gong Show- 12.7%
Family Feud PM- 12.7%
$25,000 Pyramid- 12.4%
Wild Wild World- 12.2%
Candid Camera- 12.1%
Wild Kingdom- 11.7%
All-Star Anything Goes- 11.2%
Bowling For Dollars- 10.8%
Let's Go To The Races- 10.8%

November 1978 (p.429):

Muppets- 14.7%
Family Feud PM- 14.2%
PM Magazine- 13.9%
Name That Tune- 13.4%
Price Is Right- 13.3%
Newlywed Game- 13.2%
Hollywood Squares- 13.1%
Hee Haw- 13.0%
Lawrence Welk- 12.4%
Match Game PM- 12.0%
...Havoc Struck- 12.0%
Wild Wild World- 11.6%
Vince Dooley- 11.6%
$1.98 Beauty- 10.7%
Candid Camera- 10.5%

(These ratings are for total adult households. I have copied every listing that had an adult household rating, but not the entries that had entries for women, men, teens, or children only, Titles are based on those in the World Almanac, and may not conform to actual titles).

[SRIV94]

But they air on the same channel, so they're together. (Jeopardy! still airs on WLS at 3:30- I think the only ABC O&O that still airs it in the afternoon- which, BTW, I think is a better time for it to air, don't ask me why.)

And it'll be 2:30 starting whenever Couric's talk show debuts.

[Ian Wallis]

Syndication ratings, from the 1978, 1979, and 1980 Almanacs (game shows in bold):

Thanks for those lists.  I'm always interested in ratings data from game shows "glory days".  A few surprises:  All-Star Anything Goes was actually doing quite well in fall '77.  If those ratings held up I'm surprised it didn't get another season.  Also, GSF favorite Break the Bank is nowhere to be found on the '76 list.  I guess the syndie version didn't do that well.

Game shows obviously did better at night than during the daytime, based on that other ratings list that was posted a month or so ago.

[TimK2003]

Syndication ratings, from the 1978, 1979, and 1980 Almanacs (game shows in bold):

Thanks for those lists.  I'm always interested in ratings data from game shows "glory days".  A few surprises:  All-Star Anything Goes was actually doing quite well in fall '77.  If those ratings held up I'm surprised it didn't get another season.  Also, GSF favorite Break the Bank is nowhere to be found on the '76 list.  I guess the syndie version didn't do that well.

I think there are some key players missing from the lists -- especially if "Bowling For Dollars" and LGTTR get nods (despite being in only a couple dozen markets), yet something more mainstream like "The Jokers Wild" is nowhere to be seen.

[RMF]

I think there are some key players missing from the lists -- especially if "Bowling For Dollars" and LGTTR get nods (despite being in only a couple dozen markets), yet something more mainstream like "The Jokers Wild" is nowhere to be seen.

It's highly possible that stuff's missing, and that the fact that these aren't season by season ratings may flavor this.

However, the programs on this list- game and non-game alike- seem to be chiefly those that aired in prime-access during this period. All the commentary I've seen implies that The Joker's Wild aired chiefly in daytime slots. Given this point, it isn't a surprise that it wouldn't be on this list.

Another point: The fact that Vince Dooley (who I doubt was seen in most of the country) makes this list may suggest that shows with high ratings in a few markets may have skewed the system, as the raw percentage data may have not taken this into account.

Ultimately, these aren't complete Nielsen reports, so any commentary is speculatory unless we find more complete data.

[That Don Guy]

And the NBC O&O's had a group deal for Feud, in the same way that the ABC O&O's have a group deal for WoF and J!.  (In the early '80s, the "standard" NBC O&O weeknight schedule was Feud at 7:00 and a syndicated first-run sitcom at 7:30.)

San Francisco's ABC O&O didn't have WoF and J! until 1992 or so - KRON (the NBC affiliate at the time) had both, but when it tried its ill-fated experiment of moving prime time back one hour, the shows moved to KGO (I think Entertainment Tonight and possibly Hard Copy went in the other direction, in order to make room) - it just didn't make any sense to air a game show at 10:30 PM (the other half-hour was used up by shortening the local late night news from 35 minutes to 30 and moving NBC's late-night programming back 35 minutes).