Anybody on here seen the ITV series "Quiz" based on the Charles Ingram scandal?

[vexer6]

Curious if anyone on here has seen this series?  It's a pretty fascinating account of not just the Ingram scandal, but also shows how Millionaire came to be and shows that the Ingram family were not alone and there was a whole network of people dedicated to getting an advantage on the show, I had no idea it was this elaborate.

I also must commend the actors as they really nailed their real-life counterparts, the guy who played Chris Tarrant was especially good, and I was impressed with the small details they got right(then-Disney CEO Michael Eisner bowing down before the head of ITV before buying the rights to Millionaire was a real thing that actually happened, I know this as I recently finished reading "DisneyWar" which chronicled Eisner's tenure as CEO).  I also like that series didn't totally demonize the Ingram's, they were a family with financial issues so I can understand why they'd be willing to take such a risk.  I said a decade ago that I couldn't help but be impressed at them for having the guts to carry out such a plan, and watching this series i'm even more impressed after seeing the sheer lengths they went to to even get on the show, that took serious dedication and Adrian Pollock practicing with his own homemade Fastest-Finger Question device reminded me a lot of what Michael Larsen did, and their defense in court is actually kinda convincing and i've jumped back and forth between genuinely believing they cheated and thinking that maybe they weren't guilty after all, I still haven't quite made up my mind on that, either way this is a fascinating show that I highly recommend.

I'd love for the U.S. to get a similar mini-series about Michael Larsen's time on Press Your Luck, i'd definitely tune in for that.

The show is on Amazon Prime with an AMC subscription if anyone is interested, I subbed for this show alone when I got offered a sweet deal to get AMC with Prime for 2 months for only $0.99, what a steal!

[Ryanmo97]

I watched it when AMC showed in on air last year. I thought it was very good. I liked that they showed how Millionaire came to be. I remember that at one point there was going to be a movie about Michael Larson and I think Bill Murray was going to play Larson. But, nothing happened.

[vexer6]

I watched it when AMC showed in on air last year. I thought it was very good. I liked that they showed how Millionaire came to be. I remember that at one point there was going to be a movie about Michael Larson and I think Bill Murray was going to play Larson. But, nothing happened.

Murray would've been a perfect choice.

I'm also reading the book that inspired this show("Bad Show: The Quiz, The Cough, The Millionaire Major") and the more I read the more i'm convinced that the Ingram's were innocent and that this whole thing was a tragic miscarriage of justice, if you only ever watched the documentary "Major Fraud"(which is a well made doc to be sure, but definitely leaves out a lot of information that points to the Ingrams likely innocence) I can see why one would think Charles was guilty, but the book expertly deconstructs all the arguments that the courts made to him being guilty.  Honestly at this point I hope their appeal to overturn their guilty verdicts gets granted and that Ingram finally gets that million pounds he deserves.

[TLEberle]

Really? My takeaway is that they were arrogant and too smart for their own good. If Chas. stops at £125,000 he would still be found out.

[PYLdude]

Listen to the audio from the episode, and you can clearly see there’s shenanigans afoot.

There’s been dozens of stories told about this and at least one US television investigation done into it.

Then again I’m responding to the one guy who found The Chamber to have redeeming value.

[Kevin Prather]

Really? My takeaway is that they were arrogant and too smart for their own good. If Chas. stops at £125,000 he would still be found out.

You think so? I always felt like if he walked at £250,000, they wouldn't have pursued it.

[Kniwt]

Shhhh ... here's the whole series.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1plwKAmZ4dEXmn4ADFE2LKHuHtN31g7te

[vexer6]

Listen to the audio from the episode, and you can clearly see there’s shenanigans afoot.

There’s been dozens of stories told about this and at least one US television investigation done into it.

Then again I’m responding to the one guy who found The Chamber to have redeeming value.

I have in fact listened to the episode multiple times and as the book points out, that audio was enhanced to highlight the coughs, if the episode was ran on TV that's not how it would've sounded, therefore it was not obvious in the original tape, the fact that Tarrant himself admitted under oath that he didn't notice any coughing whatsoever despite sitting across from Ingram strongly points to his innocence. Tecwen Whittock also had multiple actual diagnosed coughing conditions which made him liable to cough at any time, not just on the right answers, why on earth would Ingram rely on someone who was prone to coughing at any time and not someone without a cough who could control themselves?  It simply does not make sense.

There's also logical explanations for the questions everyone points to as evidence of his guilt, on the "Craig David" question you can hear an audible gasp from the audience(Which unlike the coughs was not "enhanced")when Ingram says A1, which was a likely telltale sign that they knew he'd guessed wrong, so it made perfect sense for him to change his answer in that instance.  As for the "Baron Hauseman" question, Tarrant kind of unintentionally guided Ingram in that instance as when he says he's sure its Berlin, Tarrant is all "10 minutes ago you were sure it was A1"which intended or not, likely gave Ingram a clue that he was going down the wrong path and thus changed his answer.  For the last question when Ingram said he was going for Googol because he'd never heard of it, Tarrant was like "that's kind of how you arrived at Paris" again unintentionally hinting that Ingram was going the correct path and convincing him to go for that answer.

Also I fail to see how me liking a show that you don't like somehow magically automatically means i'm wrong, that's some insane troll logic if I ever heard it, at least read this book and watch the show before blindly assuming i'm wrong, it's written by someone much smarter then you or me:https://www.amazon.com/Bad-Show-Cough-Millionaire-Major-ebook/dp/B00SOVGFJ2

Those investigations were fraught with many issues as the book indicates, proper procedure was not allowed in many instances leading to strong doubts.  So having dozens of investigations does not really mean anything if they are all based on a shaky foundation to begin with.

[BrandonFG]

I haven’t watched this particular series, but I remember 20/20 or one of those type shows, when they covered the scandal about a year after it happened. From what I remember, they got arrogant and a little greedy and it came back to bite them.

Not a mini-series, but GSN did a docu on the Larson controversy. Don’t know what else can be said.

Then again I’m responding to the one guy who found The Chamber to have redeeming value.

Eh. Different strokes I guess. At least Fox knows the one person to thank.

[vexer6]

I haven’t watched this particular series, but I remember 20/20 or one of those type shows, when they covered the scandal about a year after it happened. From what I remember, they got arrogant and a little greedy and it came back to bite them.

Not a mini-series, but GSN did a docu on the Larson controversy. Don’t know what else can be said.

Then again I’m responding to the one guy who found The Chamber to have redeeming value.

Eh. Different strokes I guess. At least Fox knows the one person to thank.

That they do, for this and several other shows that they cancelled too soon like Drive, Wonderfalls, War at Home, Greed, It's Your Chance of a Lifetime, etc.

[PYLdude]

I know what I saw.

Everyone else who saw it knows what they saw.

He obviously heard the coughs regardless of how loud they actually were. (And I am well aware of Tecwen’s so called coughing problem; I found it a convenient excuse then and I do so now because the coughs come for the correct answers to every question. Every time. That cannot be coincidence. That’s why you’re wrong. Not because of your opinion regarding a show that damn near killed the genre for no reason other than pure shock value. The physical evidence says otherwise.)

He cheated. It’s not rocket science, he cheated.

[vexer6]

I know what I saw.

Everyone else who saw it knows what they saw.

He obviously heard the coughs regardless of how loud they actually were. (And I am well aware of Tecwen’s so called coughing problem; I found it a convenient excuse then and I do so now because the coughs come for the correct answers to every question. Every time. That cannot be coincidence. That’s why you’re wrong. Not because of your opinion regarding a show that damn near killed the genre for no reason other than pure shock value. The physical evidence says otherwise.)

He cheated. It’s not rocket science, he cheated.

I'd say having someone who is liable to cough at any time is pretty damned inconvenient(and BTW he was diagnosed by an actual expert)

Also Charles never even met Whittock before the trial and it was only by pure chance that Whittock was even in the FFF area on the second show, there was no possible way for the Ingrams to have rigged that.

You're wrong because you've not read the book so now you don't know for an absolute fact what happened on the show.

LOL at the idea that a show that hardly anyone remembers like "The Chamber" almost killed the genre, that's just nonsensical, how could a show that got such low ratings that hardly anyone remembers possibly have almost killed the genre, you got any actual receipts for that claim or are you just talking nonsense?  As if I don't already know the answer.


It's not rocket science, he didn't cheat, let me guess, you haven't read the book because you're afraid it'll change your mind and prove me right?

Also you're incorrect, it wasn't "every time" the trial even said that there no coughing during the "Emmanthal", "Polo" and "Anthony Eden" questions, if you're going to act delusional at least get your facts right.

What they "saw" was an enhanced version of the tape highlighted to arrive at a pre-determined conclusion, not how the actual episode would've sounded if it made it to air.

Also funny how you completely dodged the fact that Tarrant said he didn't notice anything(and he also contradicted the claim that Charles and Diana had an argument after his win, saying he didn't notice them acting unusual in any way) how on earth could Charles hear the coughs but not Tarrant himself? answer me that genius.

[chrisholland03]

Hey - can we turn the tone of the conversation more towards facts and opinions about the topic vs facts and opinions about each other?

[PYLdude]

I'd say having someone who is liable to cough at any time is pretty damned inconvenient(and BTW he was diagnosed by an actual expert

And he only volunteered this after the fact that he got caught. Sorry, convenient excuse.

Also Charles never even met Whittock before the trial and it was only by pure chance that Whittock was even in the FFF area on the second show, there was no possible way for the Ingrams to have rigged that.

You can’t say that with any certainty because you weren’t there.

You're wrong because you've not read the book so now you don't know for an absolute fact what happened on the show.

I didn’t read any books on a lot of subjects, and still saw their outcomes with my own two eyes.

Also you're incorrect, it wasn't "every time" the trial even said that there no coughing during the "Emmanthal", "Polo" and "Anthony Eden" questions, if you're going to act delusional at least get your facts right.

Well shut my mouth. Three times out of how many?

“Oh, but your honor, I may have thrown fifteen punches at that guy but only twelve of them landed; that mitigates everything.”

What they "saw" was an enhanced version of the tape highlighted to arrive at a pre-determined conclusion, not how the actual episode would've sounded if it made it to air.

Okay, and what does that change? Major Ingram obviously still heard Tecwen coughing the right answers regardless of how many times he did it.

It’s possible Tarrant actually didn’t notice, but I believe there was someone in his ear telling him that they believed something was up and to just carry on like normal. He may say that he didn’t notice, but I find it hard to believe.

I again choose to let the actual evidence be my guide. And it’s clear, based on that, that Tecwen’s coughing was not coincidental and Major Ingram would not have won the million quid had Tecwen not been there.

I don’t care if he had a condition; if he really did have such a problem why wasn’t he coughing more often?

[vexer6]

I'd say having someone who is liable to cough at any time is pretty damned inconvenient(and BTW he was diagnosed by an actual expert

And he only volunteered this after the fact that he got caught. Sorry, convenient excuse.

Also Charles never even met Whittock before the trial and it was only by pure chance that Whittock was even in the FFF area on the second show, there was no possible way for the Ingrams to have rigged that.

You can’t say that with any certainty because you weren’t there.

You're wrong because you've not read the book so now you don't know for an absolute fact what happened on the show.

I didn’t read any books on a lot of subjects, and still saw their outcomes with my own two eyes.

Also you're incorrect, it wasn't "every time" the trial even said that there no coughing during the "Emmanthal", "Polo" and "Anthony Eden" questions, if you're going to act delusional at least get your facts right.

Well shut my mouth. Three times out of how many?

“Oh, but your honor, I may have thrown fifteen punches at that guy but only twelve of them landed; that mitigates everything.”

What they "saw" was an enhanced version of the tape highlighted to arrive at a pre-determined conclusion, not how the actual episode would've sounded if it made it to air.

Okay, and what does that change? Major Ingram obviously still heard Tecwen coughing the right answers regardless of how many times he did it.

It’s possible Tarrant actually didn’t notice, but I believe there was someone in his ear telling him that they believed something was up and to just carry on like normal. He may say that he didn’t notice, but I find it hard to believe.

I again choose to let the actual evidence be my guide. And it’s clear, based on that, that Tecwen’s coughing was not coincidental and Major Ingram would not have won the million quid had Tecwen not been there.

I don’t care if he had a condition; if he really did have such a problem why wasn’t he coughing more often?

Convenient my ass

Neither were you, you can keep spouting the same asinine drivel all the live long day and it won't magically make you any more correct.

You saw what the people in charge of the program WANTED you to see with your "own two eyes", you didn't see how the episode would've looked if those coughs weren't enhanced, funny how you keep conveniently dodging answering that part eh?

Three times proves the guy didn't need to cheat to get ahead genius.

No he did not "obviously" hear anything just because you some random dude on the internet says so.

Tarrant actually was not in fact wearing an earpiece because he does not like doing so as he finds them distracting, so that's not in fact true, nobody was telling him to carry on or anything like that, plain and simple he did not notice anything untoward going on, if he had, he would not have signed the check(and the checks on the show were real and not props) and he said that in his own words.

I also choose to let the evidence be my guide and to me it points to the major being innocent, but unlike you i'm not so close-minded and afraid of being proven wrong that i'm refusing to read a book.

He wasn't coughing during this time in the hot seat because according to medical diagnosis coughs are prone to changing depending on the temperature in a room, and logically Whittock would have less reason to cough once getting out of the hot audience area and with him having to concentrate on actually answering the questions he'd be more focused and therefore less likely to cough.  I can attest to that myself as during times when I was sick and doing something that required a lot of concentration, I barely even noticed my sickness and coughed a lot less.