"Password Plus" vs. "Super Password"

[gamed121683]

Hopefully, this question hasn’t been asked here before (or at least recently), but a reply in the "Kennedy Password+ Question…" topic inspired me to ask this question.

Which version of Password involving solving a puzzle do you feel was the more superior version: Password Plus or Super Password & why?

Let the debate begin!

[BrandonFG]

Plus, because of how Allen/Bill/Tom kept the game casual but moving. As others mentioned, Bert was a little too chatty at times. And as futuristic as the set looked, something about Super feels a little cold.

I did like Ca$hword, however.

[TLEberle]

Alphabetics deserves a monstrous game board. We got a 13 inch TV set. Super has a great bombastic theme and the Cashword but damn, everything else falls flat.

There’s one think I liked from SP end game—at one point the two players were shot at a diagonal so that it looked like like their concentration converged on a single point rather than facing each other like the winners circle. I thought it added to the tension.

[chris319]

Originally there were two Kodak Carousel slide projectors on the P+ set; one for the puzzle board and one inside the desk which was aimed upstage into a mirror and then to the screen built into the front of the desk.

These projectors emitted an awful lot of fan noise. Bobby Sherman was always chasing this fan noise and he experimented with a noise gate and different microphones. We always had fan noise, the bulk of which came from the projector used for the puzzle board. Eventually he got wise and that projector was replaced with art cards, which they should have been from the get-go. Two stagehands behind loaded the cards into the board. It was a big improvement, but we were still stuck with Dennis Roof's butt-ugly design with the checkerboards and stripes which looked gawd awful.

I don't know how they dealt with projector-fan noise on Blockbusters and Press Your Luck.

When I watch SP, I hear a lot of buzz in the audio from the neon tubes in the set. Apparently Bobby didn't much care. All they had to do was turn off the neon and buzz begone.

I've seen puzzle clues on SP which I wouldn't have permitted. It was easier to file a questionable puzzle under "Category 13" than to try to argue with Bobby Sherman about it. Bobby didn't keep track of the writers' output so it was easy to make a puzzle "disappear". Category 13 was my bottom-right desk drawer. Shhh, don't tell anyone.

I find the answers to puzzles harder to read on SP. For some reason the black lettering doesn't stand out against the yellow background.

Bert spent way too much time clowning around with the celebs or Gene Wood or the sound effects guy. He complains on air about various things, such as a late sound effect. Allen was showman enough to let those kinds of things slide.

[Chelsea Thrasher]

Super Password, without hesitation, though I enjoy both.  Solely a matter of personal preference, but of every permanent host that Password has had, Allen is my second least favorite ahead of only Regis. "No opposites", while a challenge, makes for a less engaging, fun, and accessible-to-viewers show. Super Password's maingame scoring system was the best of the three used although I'm not fond of the cashword minigame. Meanwhile, the final season of P+ with 100-100-200-200....all the way to 500 is a legitimate chore to sit through (on more than one occasion, a game starts on one show and ends two shows later with the aid of some discarded puzzles).  The decision to still award 80% of the bonus prize (-$1000 before the jackpot was added) with an illegal clue is also baffling both from a gameplay and a viewership perspective. 

Meanwhile, Super Password's main theme is one of the best in the genre, IMO. And while Bert's hosting shtick isn't to everyone's taste, I always found it more endearing than not (especially to what some of his contemporaries were doing in the same time periods). The final couple of years when production crew and staff became more integrated recurring characters on camera add a very strong feeling of warmth that only occasionally appears on Tom's stint with Plus, and is largely absent during Allen's tenure unless he has the right celebrities (Betty) to play off of. 

Because it often took so long to get to the bonus game during Plus' six months with the jackpot, by the time you're there again, any natural tension that should have built as it's gone unwon is lost; while on Super you get back around to it in enough time that said tension hasn't dissipated before being played again, resulting in either a bigger emotional release when won, or a bigger compounding when lost again.

Tom is definitely a little better at the "game" aspect of game show hosting, but Bert is probably a little better at the "show" aspect, particularly for the demographics tuning in. 

[Casey]

I like them both, so it's a hard pick.  But I'd have to go with Super Password.  Partly that's because that's the version I remember seeing as a kid, but there are some rules that I like better on SP than on P+. 

I was never comfortable with how "form of the word" was handled on P+.  It was different from all prior versions of Password.  SP handled this much better.  I also liked the Cashword.  And I know Bert isn't everyone's cup of tea, but I enjoyed his hosting.  He just seemed to have more fun running the game, and he also had no problems with leaving his mistakes in the show, rather than having to edit around him.  I also liked that he included Gene Wood or Tommy from behind the board, or the sound effects person.  It just made it seem like a happy environment.

[aaron sica]

There’s one think I liked from SP end game—at one point the two players were shot at a diagonal so that it looked like like their concentration converged on a single point rather than facing each other like the winners circle. I thought it added to the tension.

This also touches on a favorite of mine with bonus rounds - dimming the lights. I think that also adds to the tension. I miss when Wheel would do that (along with the drum roll) during the bonus round.

[Blanquepage]

Love them both, but I'd go with Super Password over Plus.
One of the little things that kind of annoyed me on Plus, which was corrected on Super, was that the password could literally be given in another language as a clue.
An instance in which Wesley Eure gave "agua" for "water" on Plus comes to mind, yet Tom Poston was zapped for giving "verte" as a clue for "green" on Super.
I also just prefer Bert's energy over that of Allen; there's an air about Allen that I find to be a little off-putting, a bit more so after having recently screened more of his Liar's Club.
He could come off as being a bit of a jerk, but I never got that from Bert.
The Cashword was also a fine way to add some intra-game variety.

[BillCullen1]

I'm torn here. PP moved along better but SP fixed a couple of PP's flaws. They allowed opposites to be given as clues again and if one team didn't guess the puzzle, the other team got a crack at it. So less puzzles were "wasted" and the game moved along. The cashword was a nice addition as well. Tom had started hosting Body Language shortly before SP so he wasn't available. Bert Convy was the next available host on Goodson's rolodex. He was a chatterbox at times, but he had a likeable personality and could laugh at his goof ups. Shame how he died.

Between Allen, Tom and Bill there was over 50 years of hosting. So PP usually moved along well. Making $500 the goal for winning stretched out the game and ensured that Alphabetics would not be played twice on the same show. That may have been why they did it with the escalating bonus. I remember one week on PP with Steve Allen and Jayne Meadows. They kept missing puzzles left and right. That was painful to watch.

[Jimmy Owen]

Because Bill Cullen hosted it for a few weeks, I'd go with P+.  Prefer set pieces to monitors.

[TimK2003]

My preference between the two is too close to call ‐- too many pluses and minuses for both shows.
I will say when SP first aired, I hated the set.  Compared to other shows at the time, it looked too futuristic and I thought the plain slanted shapes strewn around the set looked ugly.  I gradually got used to the set, but it still looked like a cheaper set.

[JMFabiano]

Plus, BARELY.  And mostly by personal preferences.  I like Allen/Tom/Bill a bit more as hosts.  The show looked and sounded like classic Password still, merged with something different too. 

Super had its advantages, though.  Much of which was already mentioned.  Returning opposites as acceptable clues (though if you wanted added challenge, you'd prefer Plus doing away with them).  The Cashword.  One strike in the end game = no grand prize.  (that was one of the most convoluted things in PW+, of course...20% off for each illegal clue...) 

EDIT: YES, YES about the "form of the word" whoops in SP too. 

The computer graphics in the end game looked good...and when they changed it so it was a split screen view made it look more dramatic somehow. 

Which reminds me...

There’s one think I liked from SP end game—at one point the two players were shot at a diagonal so that it looked like like their concentration converged on a single point rather than facing each other like the winners circle. I thought it added to the tension.

Okay, Pyramid had coexisted with the first 2-3 years of SP...still I wonder if someone caught on to the similarities between the Winner's Circle and the Super Password round and thus decided to change to the split screen? 

One of the little things that kind of annoyed me on Plus, which was corrected on Super, was that the password could literally be given in another language as a clue.
An instance in which Wesley Eure gave "agua" for "water" on Plus comes to mind, yet Tom Poston was zapped for giving "verte" as a clue for "green" on Super.

A failed attempt, but I think of Lucy giving "platanos" for "bananas."  Yeah technically two different things, but bear with me. 

Tom had started hosting Body Language shortly before SP so he wasn't available. Bert Convy was the next available host on Goodson's rolodex. He was a chatterbox at times, but he had a likeable personality and could laugh at his goof ups. Shame how he died.

I was thinking Bill for a moment too...but he had Joker's Wild.  Plus if SP lasted as long as it did, he'd sadly not finish the series too. 

Oddly enough, I think Tom on PW+ started the trends that Bert would turn up to 11 on SP.  The game and show was more loose and had more comedy when Tom joined, if that makes any sense.  He pretty much addresses this in the blooper episode...could you imagine Allen doing what he did in that and other cases? 

Meanwhile, the final season of P+ with 100-100-200-200....all the way to 500 is a legitimate chore to sit through (on more than one occasion, a game starts on one show and ends two shows later with the aid of some discarded puzzles).

Also true....I can see how the extended version of PW+ main games could be a slog.  SP did handle the $500 goal better, as you said.  Kind of like Celebrity Bullseye going to Best 2/3 games when a main game on the show could be long depending on contracts and winning them. 

What's y'all's feelings about SP doing away with Pass/Play? 

[Ian Wallis]

I'll go with Super Password by a hair.  Both shows are very similar and I respect both hosts - I grew up watching them.  Allen was more serious and Bert seemed like a really nice guy, but there were some days he didn't seem too interested in getting the game going.  He even mentioned on a 1985 show that there was a cue card that stated "get on with it Bert".  A show like Tattletales was a much better fit for him.

The themes for both shows were good, so I'd say that's a tie.

One thing I didn't like about it either show was the scoring format.  We've discussed before how the $100 puzzle on Super Password really has no bearing on the outcome of the game, but Password Plus' scoring system wasn't much better.  I agree that the changes made late in the run slowed everything down a little too much.  I think a perfect scenario is one bonus attempt per show, but those changes sometimes meant you'd only get about three in a week.  The "no opposites" rule took some of the fun out of it too.

I think the set for Super Password is slightly superior - it's better having the puzzle in the center rather than off to the side.

Having said that, I'll happily watch either show if I'm flipping by and they're on.

[thomas_meighan]

It's pretty much a wash for me -- each show has certain demerits that are canceled by the demerits of the other.

Plus had a more interesting set and theme, but several gameplay aspects weren't the best approach, IMO -- the 10% reduction for illegal clues in the bonus round, the inconsistent judging (which we've talked about before), opposing teams not getting a chance to guess a puzzle if a team was unsuccessful after the fifth word. The rule about antonyms I can take or leave. The 1961-75 formats allowed for easier words to be inserted into gameplay, depending on how well a game was going, so it made sense to allow for obvious opposite pairs (big/little, wet/dry), but that was no longer possible with the puzzles. I can see why they wanted to make the clues more challenging, but I don't think it was strictly necessary.

Super corrected many of these issues (if you consider them such), but it also had a host whom I don't think was a perfect fit for the game. Convy wasn't *bad*, he just needed to rein in the chatter (which gave away puzzle answers on some occasions) and perhaps to demonstrate more authority.

[Kevin Prather]

We've discussed before how the $100 puzzle on Super Password really has no bearing on the outcome of the game, but Password Plus' scoring system wasn't much better.

Having the first round be worth $100 does relegate it to basically a practice round, but it also sets up the rest of the game so that in order to win the game, you must win at least one round while giving the clues. Don't know if that was by design or a happy coincidence, but it does make it a good scoring system IMO.