Where would new panelists come from?

[DrBear]

OK, let's say that tastes change again, and game shows with celebrities are in vogue once more. When one considers that the A-listers won't do them (barring an unusual occurrence, like Whoopi  or Henry Winkler running H2), where are the reliable B-listers?

This was sorta inspired by the MG/HS recent post about the lack of "starpower" on that show's first week. Other than H2, and celebrity competitions on J! and WWTBAM, the only two shows that even tried to have celebrities were the revivals of TTTT and IGAS. IGAS went with four regular panelists, as did the old show, with a game veteran (Bullock), two good but not top-level actresses (Yasbeck/Garr, and I'm sorry, but Teri Garr hasn't done anything recently, as good as she has been) and that balding guy whose name I can never remember.

TTTT on the other hand went more with comedy in its rotating setup, which proved to be a disaster (Poundstone) and didn't work well (Poundstone) when one panelist (Poundstone) was too busy with jokes (Poundstone) to make an effort to play the game. (Meshach Taylor was OK).

The  one recent attempt was Fox's Celebrity Spelling Bee, and that may be the level we'd be at, it was a one-shot, though, and I don't see some of those people willing to be typecast as "game show panelists."

This post is getting long, so I'll throw it to anybody who wants to add something.

[Matt Ottinger]

If celebrity panel shows were to succeed again, I think they'd need to go back to the underlying concept that was always a part of What's My Line?, the idea that these celebrities (and for that matter, even the host) are busy people with successful careers, and they're just gathering together to play a game that's ultimately incidental to the rest of their lives.

Anything short of that just reeks of "game show celebrity" desperation.  That's not to say you have to get A-list people, just busy people who don't look like they need the work.

[tvrandywest]

Matt's right on. Goodson staffed the panel shows with actual 3-D people, not media pseudo-celebrities. AND... they played the game to win, not to showcase their comedic abilities. If the players don't take the game seriously, how can the audience?

Randy
tvrandywest.com

[Matt Ottinger]

[quote name=\'tvrandywest\' date=\'Apr 27 2004, 12:58 PM\'] Goodson staffed the panel shows with actual 3-D people, not media pseudo-celebrities. [/quote]
To expand on that comment from the always-insightful Mr. West, there's a difference between Goodson's pseudo-stars and other people's pseudo-stars.  The Goodson camp knew how to find and/or nurture bright, funny people who could play their games and look like they were having fun doing it, regardless of how far up the celebrity food chain they had climbed.

For a long time, those people came out of the NYC theater scene.  Folks like Anita Gillette, Alan Alda, Bert Convy, Florence Henderson, Elaine Joyce, Larry Blyden, Orson Bean, Peggy Cass and countless others were "discovered" as TV panelists after a stage credit or two.  In some cases, they became stars.  In others, their legit careers never took off.  But once their ability to play games had been established, they were "in".

Today (or even back then under almost any other packager) the object is to get people that the public knows, regardless of whether they know how (or have any interested in learning how) to play the game. Heatter-Quigley could get away with that because they almost never gave the celebrity anything particularly challenging to do.  With Goodson (and later, with an independent Bob Stewart) a celebrity had to know what he or she was doing, or else risk looking foolish.

The last time that a panel was chosen for its game playing rather than its celebrity was probably TTTT'90. (David Niven Jr, anybody?)  Everything since, including Match Game '98, O'Hurley's TTTT, Oxygen's IGAS and those abortive WML? pilots (to say nothing of lesser stuff like You Lie Like A Dog)appear to have simply picked entertainers and assumed they'd be entertaining.

And that's why panel shows don't work today.  The end.

[tommycharles]

[quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' date=\'Apr 27 2004, 01:26 PM\'] and those abortive WML? pilots (to say nothing of lesser stuff like You Lie Like A Dog)appear to have simply picked entertainers and assumed they'd be entertaining.

And that's why panel shows don't work today.  The end. [/quote]
 Erm... what WML? pilots? Does anyone have any info?

And I hope panel shows aren't gone for good, but you may be right. You know what's the key to making the UK all-celeb games work? The rivalries. They insult each other and all that in the playing of the game, and it's the best part of it, IMO.

[uncamark]

[quote name=\'DrBear\' date=\'Apr 27 2004, 10:35 AM\']This was sorta inspired by the MG/HS recent post about the lack of "starpower" on that show's first week. Other than H2, and celebrity competitions on J! and WWTBAM, the only two shows that even tried to have celebrities were the revivals of TTTT and IGAS. IGAS went with four regular panelists, as did the old show, with a game veteran (Bullock), two good but not top-level actresses (Yasbeck/Garr, and I'm sorry, but Teri Garr hasn't done anything recently, as good as she has been) and that balding guy whose name I can never remember. [/quote]
Jason Kravits (Comcast Chicago finally got Oxygen and I've been watching "IGAS" early in the morning, mostly to note what they did wrong).

But as Matt said, the secret is to get good game players who are in the biz and out to have a good time and then make stars out of them.  If I could get the money to do a panel show here in Chicago, there are a lot of witty, smart, personable actors working the theater scene here who could do a good panel show.  Unless I get up the nerve to take the public access certification, I'll never be able to prove it.

[1978-Jeopardy]

When I think of game show panelists, my mind jumps to just about everyone on M*A*S*H and Soap. Almost everyone from those shows appeared on Bob Stewart game shows.
So those are 2 sitcoms where the stars were rotated on gameshows. What two sitcoms have the following today that Soap and M*A*S*H had yesteryear?
Perhaps there simply aren't any sitcom stars that would make good panelists today. Can you imagine how awful it would be if the folks from "That 70s show" went on a new incarnation of "match game"? I think only one word can describe it...."boobs".

[davemackey]

[quote name=\'1978-Jeopardy\' date=\'Apr 27 2004, 06:45 PM\'] When I think of game show panelists, my mind jumps to just about everyone on M*A*S*H and Soap. Almost everyone from those shows appeared on Bob Stewart game shows.
So those are 2 sitcoms where the stars were rotated on gameshows. What two sitcoms have the following today that Soap and M*A*S*H had yesteryear?
Perhaps there simply aren't any sitcom stars that would make good panelists today. Can you imagine how awful it would be if the folks from "That 70s show" went on a new incarnation of "match game"? I think only one word can describe it...."boobs". [/quote]
 Well, if you take the two most popular sitcoms on TV - arguably, "Friends" and "Everybody Loves Raymond", I think the only hardcore game player you could field out of any of those casts is Brad Garrett of "Raymond", who has been doing game shows for well over 20 years. Sometimes you'll get Patricia Heaton on a show, but hey, she does Acme commercials, too, so anything's possible with her.

The "Friends" stars are too into themselves to even attempt being on a game show.

If you look at most of the people who've done "Pyramid" in the last two years, I can think of quite a few personages on there who could fit on any celeb panel. Excluding some of the "old school" types who've been on there like Fred Willard and Betty White, I can think of Kelly Packard, Debra Jo Rupp, Willie Garson, Michael Ian Black, Hal Sparks, and Steve Schirippa. They're the people who can field the next generation of celebrity panels, be it the next coming of Squares or Pyramid, or something no one's come up with yet.

[Adam Nedeff]

Erm... what WML? pilots? Does anyone have any info?

Shortly after "Millionaire" took off, CBS mounted a pair of pilots for WML? with Harry Anderson ("Night Court") as emcee, with a $1,000 top prize. One pilot had Milton Berle as Mystery Guest, the other had a special "nostalgia" Mystery Guest with video of Sean Connery appearing on the original WML? and playing a tape of him saying "Yes" or "No" for each question.

And since "provactive" material is hip and happening, one of the lines featured in the pilot, to my understanding, was a person who made bras for cows (to keep udders from being chapped in winter).

The only two panelists I can remember being named for the pilots were Betty White (Yay!) and Dr. Laura Schlessinger (Why?)

But to keep this on topic, it's hard to discern who would be a good panelist under the criteria mentioned, mainly because I hate prime-time TV so much that I don't know any real names, but it always seemed to me that supporting cast members made for better panelists than the stars for many shows, so maybe people like the soon-to-be-unemployed Jane Leeves and Lisa Kudrow; Mike Judge ("Beavis & Butthead & "King of the Hill") always struck me as a good potential panelist as he comes across as extremely bright and knowledgable of television and how it works on the few interviews I've seen ; Amy Sedaris might work well, she seems bright and ready for anything (She's assumed the old Brother Theodore role of replacing any guest who backs out on David Letterman at the last minute, and always comes across as well-prepared and very entertaining).

By the way, Pyramid and Hollywood Squares have never had a time slot earlier than 1:30 am where I live, so apologies if anyone I named has already been on a game show recently; I didn't know.

[calliaume]

[quote name=\'DrBear\' date=\'Apr 27 2004, 10:35 AM\'] IGAS went with four regular panelists, as did the old show, with a game veteran (Bullock), two good but not top-level actresses (Yasbeck/Garr, and I'm sorry, but Teri Garr hasn't done anything recently, as good as she has been) and that balding guy whose name I can never remember.
 [/quote]
 Teri Garr has multiple sclerosis, so she can't take the roles she once could.

Getting back to the subject at hand, it's dubious anyone would take a chance on putting two, three, or four relatively unknown people on a panel, no matter how bright they are.  What's My Line?'s mainstays were a New York-based gossip columnist, a New York-based radio personality, and a publishing executive.  Anyone think that would fly today?

[TimK2003]

OK, so we have covered a good ghunk of the WML?/TTTT "Parlor Game" players of the 21st century....

If current TV were ever to return to the Match Game-esque games of the past, who would be the leaders in that category for the new millenium:

Which modern day celebs could be the equivilent of Brett Somers, Charles Nelson Riley, Richard Dawson, Patty Deutch, Fannie Flagg, Betty White, etc...

•   Chris Rock could be the modern day version of Jimmy Walker, as witness of the recent week of JJ on MG76.

•   Kelly Ripa for Mary Ann Mobley (in regards to their ramblings and their tendency to run off on tangents).

Others?  

(Pretty much, the vast majority of today's current A-List TV celebs could easily work in the ditzy/dunce 1st chairs on the upper & lower tiers.)

[adamjk]

There's one person who if Match Game were ever to be revived(soon), could be one of the handful of people to appear on more on then one version of MG, and this person would likely be the only one on the revival to have been on the original 70's run. This person wasn't a regular per se, but the person appeared a few times per year on the daytime and nighttime versions (at least through MG 79, though the person did appear twice during the syndie years, both times during the first season)
Can anyone guess who I am speaking of?

[zachhoran]

[quote name=\'adamjk\' date=\'Apr 27 2004, 09:02 PM\'] There's one person who if Match Game were ever to be revived(soon), could be one of the handful of people to appear on more on then one version of MG, and this person would likely be the only one on the revival to have been on the original 70's run. This person wasn't a regular per se, but the person appeared a few times per year on the daytime and nighttime versions (at least through MG 79, though the person did appear twice during the syndie years, both times during the first season)
Can anyone guess who I am speaking of? [/quote]
 Bowzer? Jimmie Walker? Bob Barker? Who is it.

[That Don Guy]

[quote name=\'DrBear\' date=\'Apr 27 2004, 10:35 AM\'] OK, let's say that tastes change again, and game shows with celebrities are in vogue once more. When one considers that the A-listers won't do them (barring an unusual occurrence, like Whoopi  or Henry Winkler running H2), where are the reliable B-listers?
 [/quote]
As silly as this sounds, most "B-listers" nowadays end up doing animation voiceovers.  (Ever wonder what happened to, say, Patti Deutsch, or Laraine Newman, or Henry Gibson?  Answer: The Angry Beavers, As Told By Ginger, and Rocket Power, respectively.  Even Mark Hamill is into it - then again, considering that he'd be typecast as Luke Skywalker if he makes any more live-action appearances, he may not have much choice.)

Actually, a lot of game show celebs in the '70s came from somewhere where you can find them today; as supporting characters on TV shows.  Betty White, Marcia Wallace, Bill Daly, JM J Bullock, Debralee Scott (in case anybody asked whatever happened to her: the last I heard, she was Henry Gibson's agent), and so on.

(The problem is, most celebs, and especially their studios, would use it as an opportunity to plug their upcoming project, even if this is the first time they've heard of the show they were on...)

-- Don

[adamjk]

Bowzer? Jimmie Walker? Bob Barker? Who is it.

No need to get snippy now Zach. It's Bob. I just wanted to see if anyone could guess who it was. I didn't mean any harm. It was just a game is all.