The eternal debate...

[zachhoran]

[quote name=\'JMFabiano\' date=\'May 11 2005, 08:09 PM\']Roughly on the topic, my mind is a bit fuzzy on when Password was played on Ellen.  I know they pretty much did old school PW, but am I correct in recalling that Ellen doubled as host and panelist (with Betty White, of course). 

Also, speaking of OS Password, I haven't seen that in a while and wonder if proper names came up on the CBS and ABC incarnations as much as on PW+/SP.

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[/quote]

Proper names seemed to come up much more on P+ and SP than on the 60s Password, at least judging by what GSN has shown.

[saussage]

[quote name=\'GS Warehouse\' date=\'May 11 2005, 03:32 PM\']BUILD A BETTER PASSWORD
If (big if) Fremantle came to us to develop a new version of Password, which options would make the best game?
- Classic scoring or puzzles?
- Play/pass option?
- Change partners in midgame or after end game?
- Bonus: ABC version or Alphabetics?
- Include Cashword in midgame?

My idea is this: a classic Password round, then play puzzles until time runs out.  Play Cashword after the first puzzle, then change partners after that.  High score plays Alphabetics (P+ title, SP rules) for $5,000.  Of course, like I've said before, most of the passwords would have to be the TV-14 variety in order to get the attention of today's audiences.

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[/quote]
I like the idea with the exception of changing partners mid-game. It seems people just start to "gel" then things go cold again IMO although some partners are just good while other partners just plain suck. The only reason anyone would change partners mid-game is to make the playing ground more fair. They should stick with the same partners throughout the game and have the scouts pay more attention to whom they are planning to use as guests.

I would also use the SP rounds (as far as points system is concerned) over P+. Pass or play option would be into effect, Ca$hword after round 1 OR 2, small monitors or PDA-like devices to see the passwords (it bugged me in Pyramid with the cheesy laptops... almost looked like they didn't want to spend big $$ in case the show flopped so that they could then pick up the laptops and use them for something else), "The password is..." guy would be back, and Betty White would be there for the first and last weeks of episodes for that version (Betty White's over 80 now, she may not be able to wait until the final week). Oh yeah, there's no reason to digitize everything but do this instead: Big LCD screen for the puzzle but use P+ "slider thing" to reveal the passwords (sorry for the lack of the proper terminology). I like physical things that move in game shows instead of the fake gfx FF reveal answer flip. And as far as a name, call it "Tournament Password" and have similar tournament rules as in Pyramid where the 3 fastest Alphabetics contestants compete for $100,000. First one to finish Alphabetics wins the big one!

[Clay Zambo]

[quote name=\'DrBear\' date=\'May 11 2005, 01:35 PM\']Name for end game: PP: Alphabetics. SP: Super Password. Advantage: PP. (Would You Don't Say have called its Bonus Board You Don't Say!?)
[/quote]

Well-reasoned and insightful as ever, Doc.   That struck me as bizarre from the first day.

Then, too, there was Burt's "And tomorrow's 'Super Password' will be worth..." even though it was quite possible there'd be another endgame during the same episode.

And we mustn't leave out the "Shall we?" factor.  "Let's put that password up on the board, shall we?"  "Let's go back and play some more, shall we?"  I've often thought that should be part of the Super Password drinking game--but then I've thought, "Gee, I really ought to get a life."

[TLEberle]

Plus is the better by FAR.  

Faster gameplay.  Allen, while he may not be a celebrity schmoozer, kept the game moving.

More strategic gameplay.  Pass/play should always be part of Password.

Scoring system, almost a toss-up, but it goes to Plus.  The $500 format of Plus is much better, too.

Cashword swings the scale to Plus.  A single word for $1,000?  Wha?  It's a joke.  Plus, when the Cashword pot got to more than the bonus round, that's not awkward, that's plan bad form.  Dumb dumb dumb.  There are my three clues for Cashword.

Bonus round goes to Plus too.  Physical prop, compared to a TV set.  Static $5,000 compared to a growing jackpot.  $50,000 for one minute's worth of work is Too Much Money.

In my mind, there's no comparison.  It's more than Password, it's Password Plus.

[wxfrcaster]

I agree, P+ was better.  The ONLY way I would agree to a growing jackpot is if it was done in a Hot Potato fashion, where it reset for each new champion, and if you didn't make it the first time, you had a chance for $10,000 the next time, and so on.

[PYLdude]

[quote name=\'GS Warehouse\' date=\'May 11 2005, 04:32 PM\']BUILD A BETTER PASSWORD
If (big if) Fremantle came to us to develop a new version of Password, which options would make the best game?
- Classic scoring or puzzles?
- Play/pass option?
- Change partners in midgame or after end game?
- Bonus: ABC version or Alphabetics?
- Include Cashword in midgame?

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[/quote]

-As much as I think the classic format works, I gotta give the advantage to the puzzles, but not by much. It adds to the game by making the contestant think, "OK, now I solved the password...now how does it fit in with the rest of the puzzle?"

-Play/Pass, I could honestly go either way. If you're playing Password Plus, yes. If you play SP, with the tougher words, it's moot, because most of the game would just be that- playing and passing. I guess it would all depend on how easy or hard the people behind the scenes planned on making the game.

-Partner change? Midgame.

-The Alphabetics/SP round I think was the better bonus round because of the challenge facing the team. Whereas before you just had to come up with the set amount of words in the set amount of time, with the other format you always had to mind what letter you were on. I'd also like the accumulating jackpot to return. I know Travis doesn't like it because of the factor that it's a lot of money for not a lot of work, but I see it like this. Say you're playing for the $55,000 in the Super Password round, and win it. You did something that hadn't been done in the previous ten times the round was played. I feel that you should at least be entitled to reap the benefits. Granted, the people after you may not have that same giant pot when they win, but the point remains the same.

-I like Cashword. I wouldn't have it go so high (maybe take a little longer to get there- $1,000 plus $500 a day?), but I think it works.

[whewfan]

Someone mentioned a SP drinking game... let's do that!

SUPER PASSWORD

One drink if
Bert says "shall we?", "moving right along"
Gene Wood whispers the password
Rich Jeffries is announcing
Bert announces he knows the puzzle, one more drink if he writes it down on a piece of paper
Bert says "on the board we have", and "you didn't need..."

Two drinks if
Bert accidentally reveals the password
The puzzleboard screws up in some fashion, one more drink if Tom, the puzzleboard operator, pops up.
Bert accidentally reveals the solution to the puzzle

Three drinks if
Gene appears on camera
The game is so long, the "end game" is not played that day

PASSWORD PLUS
ALLEN LUDDEN

One drink if
Allen gets flustered over a questionable clue
Allen gestures with his arm upon revealing the password
The camera gets a close up of Allen's face (according to Chris C, a must for Ludden)
Allen leans against the podium
Allen mentions Betty White

Two drinks if
Allen mentions his stomach pain
Allen sings
Says "Hi Doll"

Three drinks if
Allen loses it over a silly clue

TOM KENNEDY

One drink if
Tom mentions Allen or Betty
Tom says to the contestant "Tell us the (contestant's name) story"
Tom laughs

Two drinks if
Tom loses it so badly that he can barely get through the show

[dmota104]

[quote name=\'GS Warehouse\' date=\'May 11 2005, 03:32 PM\']I've been wanting to post this concept, so I figure this is a good place as any:

BUILD A BETTER PASSWORD
If (big if) Fremantle came to us to develop a new version of Password, which options would make the best game?
- Classic scoring or puzzles?
- Play/pass option?
- Change partners in midgame or after end game?
- Bonus: ABC version or Alphabetics?
- Include Cashword in midgame?
[/quote]

You've got questions, I've got answers (in order)...

-Puzzles -- but make each one worth $250 with $750 winning the game.  Meaning the first round actually matters and it takes three puzzles to win the game.  

-Definitely allow for play/pass

-Partner change after the second puzzle.

-Alphabetics (heck, SP could've called their endgame "the lightning round" as a way to salute the original...but I digress).

-Play the CA$HWORD after the second puzzle

...more thoughts.  Just call the revival simply Password .We've gone more than a decade since SP.  While a title such as Super Password Plus would be funny to us, the rest of the world wouldn't get the joke.

Also, if the score's tied 500-500, the civilians would play a tie-breaker puzzle.  The player who had 500 first could elect to solve the puzzle first -- or let his/her opponent take a crack at it.  From there, the civvies would take turns trying to solve the puzzle (1st password revealed for one player, the first 2/5 for the other, back to the first with 3/5 of the passwords revealed, the other tries with all but the last password revealed, if still no winner, each player gets one more guess with all five passwords on the board).

[14gameshows]

Puzzles-- First puzzle is worth $500, second is worth $1000, third is worth $1500, and fourth is worth $2000.  It takes $2500 to win the game to go to Alphabetics.  

Opinion needed on this....do you think that if the players didn't get the puzzle on the last clue that the money should be added to the next amount...a la Tattletales (celebs all missed thus the money is added to the pot)?

Tough words, too bad so sad, no pass/play option here--It wasn't used on the original version of Password, why here?  Had I gone with the "no opposites rule" then yes, but I'm keeping it simple.

Partner change, I like it.  Keep it!

End Game (Alphabetics)  Jackpot starts off at $10,000 and grows $5000 more each time not won.  $500 a word will be offered if you don't get all ten.

Ca$hword....no not this version, it would be called PRIZEWORD.  After the second puzzle is played, there would be a difficult word for the civie to guess and if they guess it, they win a nice prize.  If they don't then that prize carries over to the next day and another prize will be added to the stash.  Prizes would be worth at least $1000 and no more than $2000 in value.  (remember Secret square stash).

Why ruin a good format???

This is one of the versions I came up with.

[SRIV94]

[quote name=\'14gameshows\' date=\'May 12 2005, 08:36 AM\']Puzzles-- First puzzle is worth $500, second is worth $1000, third is worth $1500, and fourth is worth $2000.  It takes $2500 to win the game to go to Alphabetics. 

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Not bad, but you've hit upon the one flaw of SP's scoring system (which you've just replicated ×5)--solving the first puzzle does nothing to help you win the game.  I'd make it $1000, $1000, $1500 and $2000, with $3000 needed to win.  Yes, it's theoretically possible that puzzle 1 still becomes superfluous but it'd be less superfluous than your way.

Doug -- and the countdown to 7343 continues

[JMFabiano]

[quote name=\'whewfan\' date=\'May 12 2005, 04:51 AM\']
Someone mentioned a SP drinking game... let's do that!

SUPER PASSWORD

One drink if
Bert says "shall we?", "moving right along"
Gene Wood whispers the password
Rich Jeffries is announcing
Bert announces he knows the puzzle, one more drink if he writes it down on a piece of paper
Bert says "on the board we have", and "you didn't need..."
[/quote]

Earliest episodes: If in the end game, he describes the letters as the "initials letters of the password."  As the show went on, I'd say tap a keg when Bert actually calls the words "passwords."

When he points out the check, "signed by Mark Goodson," during Ca$hword.  

Two drinks if
Bert accidentally reveals the password
The puzzleboard screws up in some fashion, one more drink if Tom, the puzzleboard operator, pops up.
Bert accidentally reveals the solution to the puzzle

Three drinks if
Gene appears on camera
The game is so long, the "end game" is not played that day

PASSWORD PLUS
ALLEN LUDDEN

One drink if
Allen gets flustered over a questionable clue
Allen gestures with his arm upon revealing the password
The camera gets a close up of Allen's face (according to Chris C, a must for Ludden)
Allen leans against the podium
Allen mentions Betty White[/quote]

How could you forget:
If...
Allen asks "Have you got it at home?"
Addresses viewers who missed the last program, "If you weren't here last time, where were you?" (and such)
Reads a password from the home viewers

Two drinks if
Allen mentions his stomach pain
Allen sings
Says "Hi Doll"

Three drinks if
Allen loses it over a silly clue

TOM KENNEDY

One drink if
Tom mentions Allen or Betty
Tom says to the contestant "Tell us the (contestant's name) story"
Tom laughs

Tom calls the first password of a game a "$X00 puzzle" or otherwise mixes up the words "password" and "puzzle."  
Mentions the complete name of the show in the course of the game(s).  
Refers to an illegal clue as a "disqualification"
Newer one: builds up a possible match-winning puzzle ("If you're right/if it is ANSWER, you have won the game..."  I remember him doing this for all the possible wins in the 1982 episodes)  
Asks the audience to show by applause if they know the answer to the puzzle.  

Two drinks if
Tom loses it so badly that he can barely get through the show

Tap a keg if:
Tom reads a password from a home viewer

[Don Howard]

[quote name=\'14gameshows\' date=\'May 12 2005, 08:36 AM\']End Game (Alphabetics)  Jackpot starts off at $10,000 and grows $5000 more each time not won.  $500 a word will be offered if you don't get all ten.

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Too much consolation cash. $4500 possible for solving all but one? MMS. $200 per word maybe. I can go along with the top prize jackpot-increasing structure you've got there.
Unfortunately, the focus groups will insist that words like this be used. A typical Alphabetics list follows:
ANUS BOOBS CROTCH DISS ENEMA FART GIZZ HELL IMPOTENT JEZEBEL
Better no Password than 'Tude Password.

[uncamark]

[quote name=\'Don Howard\' date=\'May 12 2005, 10:46 AM\'][quote name=\'14gameshows\' date=\'May 12 2005, 08:36 AM\']End Game (Alphabetics)  Jackpot starts off at $10,000 and grows $5000 more each time not won.  $500 a word will be offered if you don't get all ten.

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Too much consolation cash. $4500 possible for solving all but one? MMS. $200 per word maybe. I can go along with the top prize jackpot-increasing structure you've got there.
Unfortunately, the focus groups will insist that words like this be used. A typical Alphabetics list follows:
ANUS BOOBS CROTCH DISS ENEMA FART GIZZ HELL IMPOTENT JEZEBEL
Better no Password than 'Tude Password.

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That's the front game.  You still have to play the end game straight, even if that "MG'98" audience did fill in the blank for BEN __________ as "Dover."

(Of course, I agree with you, but I was just making a point.  Hopefully, there'd be someone at Fremantle [Mandel?] who can remind them that the humor in "Password" comes out of the game playing, not the material.  If the only clues players can use are the above, than so be it, wlthough it doesn't say much for the players.)

[Clay Zambo]

[quote name=\'GS Warehouse\' date=\'May 11 2005, 03:32 PM\']-Puzzles -- but make each one worth $250 with $750 winning the game.  Meaning the first round actually matters and it takes three puzzles to win the game. 
[/quote]

Seems like a way to guarantee you'll only get one endgame per day--and frequently, to not get one in at all.

What's wrong with best-two-out-of-three wins $1000 (or whatever the budget decrees, maybe a nice handknitted sweater) and plays the Lightning Round?

[Clay Zambo]

[quote name=\'uncamark\' date=\'May 12 2005, 11:12 AM\'](Of course, I agree with you, but I was just making a point.  Hopefully, there'd be someone at Fremantle [Mandel?] ....
[/quote]

Nope.  I believe Mr. I. has taken leave of Fremantle by now.