The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: tpirfan28 on October 10, 2009, 03:10:42 PM
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Normally, most of the comments on my YouTube videos equates to garbage, but this one recently caught my eye:
At least Bullard wasn't that bad of a host. Richard Karn was a far bigger catastrophe.
Found it really interesting. So I pose the question - which hosts would we classify as "bad"?
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The first one that came to my mind was Jack Gallagher on The Big Spin. The episode on YouTube where someone wins a millions dollars had him showing no excitement at all when it happened nor at any other point during the show. He really looked like he would've rather been anywhere else but there.
In fact, that type is who I'd say makes the worst host in general: the person who's doing a game show as a side job, and it's evident in their hosting (other example: Louie Anderson). Although Karn was very repetitive in his hosting, he did look like he enjoyed what he was doing.
Anthony
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[quote name=\'beatlefreak84\' post=\'228201\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 02:43 PM\']In fact, that type is who I'd say makes the worst host in general: the person who's doing a game show as a side job, and it's evident in their hosting (other example: Louie Anderson).[/quote]
Or the person who's doing it because they probably can't find another job....paging Jack Kelly to the white courtesy phone, please.
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[quote name=\'tomobrien\' post=\'228202\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 03:55 PM\'][quote name=\'beatlefreak84\' post=\'228201\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 02:43 PM\']In fact, that type is who I'd say makes the worst host in general: the person who's doing a game show as a side job, and it's evident in their hosting (other example: Louie Anderson).[/quote]
Or the person who's doing it because they probably can't find another job....paging Jack Kelly to the white courtesy phone, please.
[/quote]
I thought Jack did a good job on $ale. I was happy to see him resurface on "The Hardy Boys" a few years later.
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You could probably classify bad hosts into five categories:
Johnny Paycheck - the hosts who are only there to pay the bills, and it shows in the lack of enthusiasm in their work. Examples: Louie Anderson, Jack Gallagher, Patrick Duffy, Jimmy Kimmel
Tries Too Hard - the ones who pretend to be a game show host instead of hosting a game show, exuding all the cheesy caricatures of a host. Examples: Patrick Wayne, Chris Wylde, Donny Osmond, about 80% of the hosts of kids shows
Technically Unsound - the people who just don't have the chops to run a game smoothly. Examples: Jim Caldwell, Michael Carrington, Jim Lange (take him out of The Dating Game and he flounders)
Stiffs - no engaging personality whatsoever. Examples: Ron Maestri, Joe Farago, Mike Reilly, Ty Treadway
Guilty by Association - the show's bad, so the host has no opportunity to be anything other than bad as well. Examples: Roger Lodge, Kirk Fogg (once Olmec took over all the game explanations), Rossi Morreale, Corbin Bernsen
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[quote name=\'Loogaroo\' post=\'228220\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 08:45 PM\']Skip Carrington[/quote]
The two-headed beast of bad hosting. ;-)
/Lackey, Michael
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[quote name=\'jalman\' post=\'228222\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 07:52 PM\'][quote name=\'Loogaroo\' post=\'228220\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 08:45 PM\']Skip Carrington[/quote]
The two-headed beast of bad hosting. ;-)
/Lackey, Michael
[/quote]
Whoops. Fixed it. (Lackey's more in the "Tries Too Hard" camp, to be honest)
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[quote name=\'Loogaroo\' post=\'228220\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 08:45 PM\']Jim Lange (take him out of The Dating Game and he flounders)[/quote]
Wha? Tha? F?
He worked out well on every show he did. "Spin-Off", "Give and Take", "Bullseye", "$1,000,000 Chance of a Lifetime" and "$100,000 Name That Tune" were all really helped by his steady hand.
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I'm surprised nobody has mentioned Henry Polic II......
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[quote name=\'davemackey\' post=\'228227\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 09:18 PM\'][quote name=\'Loogaroo\' post=\'228220\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 08:45 PM\']Jim Lange (take him out of The Dating Game and he flounders)[/quote]
Wha? Tha? F?
He worked out well on every show he did. "Spin-Off", "Give and Take", "Bullseye", "$1,000,000 Chance of a Lifetime" and "$100,000 Name That Tune" were all really helped by his steady hand.
[/quote]
I would put Jim closer to the "stiff" category than the other one. But then again, reading the games that Jim hosted, he didn't really get anything solid to host beyond Dating Game.
Tyshaun
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I don't count Donny Osmond as "trying too hard". I felt he was just being Donny Osmond.
/"Being Donny Osmond." Rated G, obviously.
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[quote name=\'davemackey\' post=\'228227\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 06:18 PM\'][quote name=\'Loogaroo\' post=\'228220\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 08:45 PM\']Jim Lange (take him out of The Dating Game and he flounders)[/quote]
Wha? Tha? F?
He worked out well on every show he did. "Spin-Off", "Give and Take", "Bullseye", "$1,000,000 Chance of a Lifetime" and "$100,000 Name That Tune" were all really helped by his steady hand.
[/quote]
Never saw Spin-off or Give and Take. I'm a total Bullseye mark, but I do think Jim was the Weakest Link on that show. Chance of a Lifetime and Name That Tune are where I have to echo Dave's sentiments and call B.S. I think he was absolutely brilliant on both shows.
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[quote name=\'Loogaroo\' post=\'228220\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 05:45 PM\']Donny Osmond, about 80% of the hosts of kids shows[/quote]I would disagree here; I thought Donny was not only a decent host, I thought he was by a country mile the best thing about the most recent Pyramid revival.
[quote name=\'davemackey\' post=\'228227\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 06:18 PM\']He worked out well on every show he did. "Spin-Off", "Give and Take", "Bullseye", "$1,000,000 Chance of a Lifetime" and "$100,000 Name That Tune" were all really helped by his steady hand.[/quote]I agree with Tim. Jim Lange's "steady hand" either never moved, or moved so slowly that you're waiting for something to happen.
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Jim Lange: I had the treat of watching a rare episode of "Oh My Word," a panel show produced in San Francisco, pre-"Dating Game." Lange was very affable and relaxed in keeping with the chattiness of the format - he was neither stiff nor floundering. (There's a clip on YouTube.)
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wF8cygnrxmM>
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Guilty by Association - the show's bad, so the host has no opportunity to be anything other than bad as well. Examples: Roger Lodge, Kirk Fogg (once Olmec took over all the game explanations), Rossi Morreale, Corbin Bernsen
[/quote]
I thought Roger Lodge did well with Camoflauge.
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[quote name=\'ChrisLambert!\' post=\'228239\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 10:52 PM\']I don't count Donny Osmond as "trying too hard". I felt he was just being Donny Osmond.[/quote]
Osmond came off as being totally scripted, and the times he did ad-lib, it was when someone messed up in the Winners Circle and he'd come zooming in from the wings screaming "Oh! Oh! Oh! You said Paula! It was Famous Paulas!"
[quote name=\'whewfan\' post=\'228272\' date=\'Oct 11 2009, 05:35 AM\']I thought Roger Lodge did well with Camoflauge.[/quote]
Again, he didn't do anything that I saw which couldn't have been done by any other person - read clue, call player, rule answer correct, explain the clue verbatim, repeat for the duration of the show.
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Ex-athlete tends to equal lousy emcee: Rolf Benirschke, Jimmy Cefalo, Summer Sanders, Ahmad Rashad... Danny Bonaduce if you call binge drinking a sport, and I know people who do...
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[quote name=\'Loogaroo\' post=\'228220\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 08:45 PM\']Technically Unsound - the people who just don't have the chops to run a game smoothly. Examples: Jim Caldwell, Michael Carrington, Jim Lange (take him out of The Dating Game and he flounders)[/quote]
I disagree about Jim Lange completely. I'd like to substitute him with a host who definitely belongs here - John "Dimples" Davidson who was cheesy as well.
As for former athletes, I thought Joe Garagiola and Ahmad Rashad worked out well.
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I don't know that Jim Lange is technically unsound, but he's the epitome of stiff. God love him, he's originally from Minnesota, but Lange brought nothing to the table but good pipes. It deserves mention that his big success, The Dating Game, asks less of its host than any other game. The contestant asks the questions herself! If Johnny Jacobs introduced the bachelors and described the date, he'd say ten words the whole show.
And I can't call Donny and Rossi "guilty by association." Rossi's performance was definitely a key problem, and Donny stiltedness only helped the disaster that was "Pyramid." I'd put Mike Reilly there--I thought he was plucky and a gamer, although I liked Monopoly more than most.
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Henry Polic II deserves to be mentioned among bad hosts, but I'm still surprised I'm the first to mention Blake Eammons.
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[quote name=\'davemackey\' post=\'228227\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 08:18 PM\']"Spin-Off", "Give and Take", "Bullseye", "$1,000,000 Chance of a Lifetime" and "$100,000 Name That Tune" were all really helped by his steady hand.[/quote]
That's true. Without Jim, "Name That Tune" might have seemed tired and dated.
I'm surprised I'm the second to mention Blake Eammons.
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[quote name=\'Loogaroo\' post=\'228276\' date=\'Oct 11 2009, 08:02 AM\'][quote name=\'ChrisLambert!\' post=\'228239\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 10:52 PM\']I don't count Donny Osmond as "trying too hard". I felt he was just being Donny Osmond.[/quote]
Osmond came off as being totally scripted, and the times he did ad-lib, it was when someone messed up in the Winners Circle and he'd come zooming in from the wings screaming "Oh! Oh! Oh! You said Paula! It was Famous Paulas!"[/quote]
That screaming was my #1 problem with Donny.
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[quote name=\'tpirfan28\' post=\'228195\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 03:10 PM\']Normally, most of the comments on my YouTube videos equates to garbage, but this one recently caught my eye:
At least Bullard wasn't that bad of a host. Richard Karn was a far bigger catastrophe.
Found it really interesting. So I pose the question - which hosts would we classify as "bad"?
[/quote]
OT, but I think revisionist fanboi history hasn't been kind to Karn. He wasn't GREAT (certainly better than Louie, but not a tall order), but I don't recall him getting annoying until the DTP! routine started. And isn't it half the fault of the producers for encouraging the applause at said statement?
The Karn era is underappreciated, IMO...just for the reason that they started fitting in more of classic Feud that would culminate in the O'Hurley renaissance (Single/Single/DOUBLE THE POINTS/TRIPLE ETC. ETC., 300 to win, returning champions, even the set was for a while a cross between the classic colors and the pre-O'Hurley style)
/And FYI, "DOUBLE THE POINTS!!!!!" > "I'm a nice guy!"
//As in, overstating the rules > "No, because those are the rules of the game!"
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Ex-athlete tends to equal lousy emcee: Rolf Benirschke, Jimmy Cefalo, Summer Sanders, Ahmad Rashad... Danny Bonaduce if you call binge drinking a sport, and I know people who do...
I thought Ahmad did a decent job - I actually liked Caesars Challenge quite a bit. I didn't think Jimmy Cefalo was that bad either.
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[quote name=\'JMFabiano\' post=\'228348\' date=\'Oct 12 2009, 12:10 PM\'][quote name=\'tpirfan28\' post=\'228195\' date=\'Oct 10 2009, 03:10 PM\']Normally, most of the comments on my YouTube videos equates to garbage, but this one recently caught my eye:
At least Bullard wasn't that bad of a host. Richard Karn was a far bigger catastrophe.
Found it really interesting. So I pose the question - which hosts would we classify as "bad"?
[/quote]
OT, but I think revisionist fanboi history hasn't been kind to Karn. He wasn't GREAT (certainly better than Louie, but not a tall order), but I don't recall him getting annoying until the DTP! routine started. And isn't it half the fault of the producers for encouraging the applause at said statement?
The Karn era is underappreciated, IMO...just for the reason that they started fitting in more of classic Feud that would culminate in the O'Hurley renaissance (Single/Single/DOUBLE THE POINTS/TRIPLE ETC. ETC., 300 to win, returning champions, even the set was for a while a cross between the classic colors and the pre-O'Hurley style)
/And FYI, "DOUBLE THE POINTS!!!!!" > "I'm a nice guy!"
//As in, overstating the rules > "No, because those are the rules of the game!"
[/quote]
I know I prefer the old days, but here's what I think Karn needed superficially: A shave, a haircut, a good wardrobe and to lose a few pounds. The role on "Home Improvement" required a certain scruffiness, not "Family Feud."
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I know I prefer the old days, but here's what I think Karn needed superficially: A shave, a haircut, a good wardrobe and to lose a few pounds. The role on "Home Improvement" required a certain scruffiness, not "Family Feud."
Agreed on the wardrobe part. I've stated before that I prefer host to wear ties. It's still noticable when Drew Carey doesn't wear one on Price is Right (like today, for example...)
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[quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' post=\'228356\' date=\'Oct 12 2009, 11:46 AM\']Agreed on the wardrobe part. I've stated before that I prefer host to wear ties. It's still noticable when Drew Carey doesn't wear one on Price is Right (like today, for example...)[/quote]
What about the announcer? Jonathan Mangum is pretty good on the new LMAD, but they either need to dress him up or ditch the sportcoat. The "Iowan goes to Casino Night at the Legion Hall" look doesn't quite do. And can't they give him a wireless mike, so he doesn't need to juggle the handheld along with the box on the tray?
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[quote name=\'comicus\' post=\'228277\' date=\'Oct 11 2009, 08:11 AM\']Benirschke[/quote]
Gesundheit.
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[quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' post=\'228356\' date=\'Oct 12 2009, 12:46 PM\']
I know I prefer the old days, but here's what I think Karn needed superficially: A shave, a haircut, a good wardrobe and to lose a few pounds. The role on "Home Improvement" required a certain scruffiness, not "Family Feud."
Agreed on the wardrobe part. I've stated before that I prefer host to wear ties. It's still noticable when Drew Carey doesn't wear one on Price is Right (like today, for example...)
[/quote]
Once or twice a week, I don't really mind. It reminds me of when hosts wore open-collar leisure suits in the 70s. I have a problem when every single day was open-collar day (see Osmond, Donny or Treadway, Ty).
Karn wasn't bad...he wasn't good either. Chris C. often said that he was a scenery chewer, and I can't argue with that. I found him to be your generic game show host that you see in sitcoms. However, I had a problem with that era of Feud in general, mainly from the production standpoint. Yelling doesn't make the show more exiciting, and the Double the Points cheering was just stupid.
Anderson was by far worse, in that he was there just for the paycheck; MadTV nailed the delivery of his hosting style. However, the production seemed a little more competent with Louie hosting, except for that damned Triple round.
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[quote name=\'fostergray82\' post=\'228370\' date=\'Oct 12 2009, 02:16 PM\'][quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' post=\'228356\' date=\'Oct 12 2009, 12:46 PM\']
I know I prefer the old days, but here's what I think Karn needed superficially: A shave, a haircut, a good wardrobe and to lose a few pounds. The role on "Home Improvement" required a certain scruffiness, not "Family Feud."
Agreed on the wardrobe part. I've stated before that I prefer host to wear ties. It's still noticable when Drew Carey doesn't wear one on Price is Right (like today, for example...)
[/quote]
Once or twice a week, I don't really mind. It reminds me of when hosts wore open-collar leisure suits in the 70s. I have a problem when every single day was open-collar day (see Osmond, Donny or Treadway, Ty).
[/quote]
How about "casual Fridays" on Bergeron HS???
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[quote name=\'JMFabiano\' post=\'228382\' date=\'Oct 12 2009, 04:41 PM\']How about "casual Fridays" on Bergeron HS???[/quote]
It falls into the once a week category, so I'm okay with that. By the fifth or sixth season, however, Bergeron began wearing casual clothes everyday.
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[quote name=\'comicus\' post=\'228277\' date=\'Oct 11 2009, 08:11 AM\']Ex-athlete tends to equal lousy emcee: ... Summer Sanders[/quote] Let's be fair here. I was 14-17 when Figure It Out was on the air, and I didn't think Summer Sanders was a bad host. It's not like the show really demanded much from the emcee, as the show was more about the panel and the contestants (and their talents.)
Summer's role in the show was similar to Roger Lodge's role in Camouflage (as indicated up thread): introduce contestant, start round, say panelist's name when it's their turn, end and recap round, rinse and repeat. Whether or not you want to call her "lousy" is certainly up to you; She did an ok job; not groundbreaking by any means, but she didn't bring the show down at all, IMO.
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[quote name=\'crazdgamer\' post=\'228459\' date=\'Oct 13 2009, 03:56 PM\'][quote name=\'comicus\' post=\'228277\' date=\'Oct 11 2009, 08:11 AM\']Ex-athlete tends to equal lousy emcee: ... Summer Sanders[/quote] Let's be fair here. I was 14-17 when Figure It Out was on the air, and I didn't think Summer Sanders was a bad host.
[/quote]
I was 36-39 and I thought she was great!
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[quote name=\'Twentington\' post=\'228304\' date=\'Oct 11 2009, 01:22 PM\']That screaming was my #1 problem with Donny.[/quote]
That and I absolutely detest hosts who ask the audience to shout out the answers to things that ARE ALREADY REVEALED to them, somehow in hopes of making the audience look bright and the contestant feel stupid. Even the most brain-dead audience members can usually read at a basic level and shout "THINGS THAT MAKE YOUR BUTT ITCH" when cued by Donny.
And I say this in spite of getting my early-elementary school aged ass kicked frequently for being the only boy of that age to be a professed Donny Osmond fan and even bringing my treasured "Puppy Love" LP to school...so I clearly have no anti-Donny bias...:)
Jake
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[quote name=\'JMFabiano\' post=\'228348\' date=\'Oct 12 2009, 09:10 AM\']OT, but I think revisionist fanboi history hasn't been kind to Karn. He wasn't GREAT (certainly better than Louie, but not a tall order), but I don't recall him getting annoying until the DTP! routine started. And isn't it half the fault of the producers for encouraging the applause at said statement?[/quote]I think much of that can be blamed on the people who would make a Karn joke instead of contributing something. You couldn't psot something about a Richard Karn Golf Tournament without seeing a "But do they double the points on the third hole?" sort of thing. And ditto for Tic Tac 90. And so on. So we get this snowball of not-quite-humor that replaces what actually was.
Karn was competent, but the problem is that the host of Family Feud is at the forefront for almost the entire show. Anyone could read quiz questions and melt into the background, but someone like a Tom Kennedy, Art Fleming or Alex Trebek carry the job with class.
Hey, that reminds me, I have one for the bad list.
One of the things that bothers me most about a game show host is when he violates a cardinal rule: getting laughs at the expense of your contestant. And perhaps worse than Bob Eubanks is Regis Philbin. I would pick up my jaw at some of the things he would say to the Hot Seat contestants. Millionaire is one of the most tense shows on television when the action goes, and I think it is bad form to poke fun at your contestants when they're in such a state.
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[quote name=\'Loogaroo\' post=\'228220\' date=\'Oct 11 2009, 11:45 AM\']Stiffs - no engaging personality whatsoever. Examples: Ron Maestri, Joe Farago, Mike Reilly, Ty Treadway[/quote]
I have to agree with you on Mike Reilly.
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[quote name=\'TLEberle\' post=\'228484\' date=\'Oct 14 2009, 01:14 AM\']One of the things that bothers me most about a game show host is when he violates a cardinal rule: getting laughs at the expense of your contestant. And perhaps worse than Bob Eubanks is Regis Philbin. I would pick up my jaw at some of the things he would say to the Hot Seat contestants. Millionaire is one of the most tense shows on television when the action goes, and I think it is bad form to poke fun at your contestants when they're in such a state.[/quote]
That's a fine line there. Poking fun helps make a show a show. I'd say Regis is very good at giving grief in a charming, non-threatening way. Rayburn was good at it. Dawson and Barker both were, but became tired and surly. Maybe Ludden was the first to acknowledge dumb game play with his silent wink to the camera. Even Anne Robinson on "Weakest Link" knew to give the wink at the end of the show to say it's all in good fun.
Karn is a dud. He's capable but by no means smooth and not the least bit funny. Jim Lange at least wore a tie.
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I just wonder if Jim Lange was just a decent host given VERY weak formats. Dating Game hardly needed a host the way he did it, but then again, Barris was right that the CONTESTANTS drive the show, and the host's role is minimal for that show.
Name That Tune was very solid, and I felt Jim Lange was about as good as Tom Kennedy. Perhaps more variety in the games would've helped.
Bullseye was also a solid game, just slowed down with all the rules, especially when a Bullseye was hit in the main game.
Million Dollar Chance of a Lifetime was basically a well disguised WOF variant, but I felt Jim handled the show very well.
Take My Word For It, for me, was a little too cerebral, and the celebs either didn't try hard enough or tried too hard to be funny. Wordplay, a very similar show, at least attempted to have comedy writers write material for the celebs, which was hit or miss (more of the latter)
Triple Threat- Not a bad game. Celebs playing neither helped or hindered the gameplay, so I think the game could've also worked with all civilians.
Newlywed Game- Man was THIS awkward, but then again, it would be equally awkward to see Bob Eubanks host The Dating Game. A host switch might be interesting for one show, but for me, Eubanks will ALWAYS be Newlywed Game.
Give and Take- All you do is hit a button which randomly stops a spinning arrow... I mean, a game show where you literally only have to hit a button to win a prize... it would NEVER work (Oh wait... Press Your Luck, nevermind!)
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[quote name=\'JakeT\' post=\'228473\' date=\'Oct 13 2009, 11:26 PM\']I absolutely detest hosts who ask the audience to shout out the answers to things that ARE ALREADY REVEALED to them, somehow in hopes of making the audience look bright and the contestant feel stupid.[/quote]So you hate Richard Dawson, Ray Combs, Louie Anderson, Richard Karn and John O'Hurley on that basis alone?
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[quote name=\'chad1m\' post=\'228506\' date=\'Oct 14 2009, 04:51 PM\'][quote name=\'JakeT\' post=\'228473\' date=\'Oct 13 2009, 11:26 PM\']I absolutely detest hosts who ask the audience to shout out the answers to things that ARE ALREADY REVEALED to them, somehow in hopes of making the audience look bright and the contestant feel stupid.[/quote]So you hate Richard Dawson, Ray Combs, Louie Anderson, Richard Karn and John O'Hurley on that basis alone?
[/quote]
That's a bit different. The survey answers are still revealed after the fact, so the audience doesn't know the remaining answers any more than the family members do. In the case of Donnymid, the answer was sitting there for the better part of 60 seconds, so it's more of a "No s**t, Sherlock!" scenario for the contestant not getting it, and it rubs it in because the answer is blatantly there. On Feud, it's more like "Oh, of course! Why didn't I think of that?!" or "I was just about to say that!"