The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: The Pyramids on March 06, 2010, 03:37:57 PM
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What can you remember about 'Second Chance'? Namely how close was it in look and feel to 'Press Your Luck'? As far as I know a regular episode has never surfaced.
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I loved it. The question round was slower and more cerebral, although I don't recall how hard the questions were. And at some point they changed the $5000 space to an eggcrate readout that would randomly stop when the spinner did on some thousands of dollars, a change that appeared cheap. And was cheap, though perhaps necessarily so.
The music and board SFX were and are awesome, and the board unfolding during the opening had no purpose yet was way cool.
An observation--the Carruthers used the Whammy on PYL, and they'd used it on Beat the Odds. So why did Second Chance have a devil, especially when Joker's Wild had one at the same time?
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It had a brighter feel to it than PYL. Turning set was cooler than PYL. Jim Peck has always been a favorite host of mine, so he can do no wrong in my book. On SC, the game was about hoping people would win, whereas on PYL, you were hoping people would lose, so you could see the cute animations. The buzz-in format of PYL was a little less fair to the contestants than the write-it-down system of of Q&A on SC. I also liked the music package of SC better.
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[quote name=\'Neumms\' post=\'237000\' date=\'Mar 6 2010, 04:18 PM\']An observation--the Carruthers used the Whammy on PYL, and they'd used it on Beat the Odds. So why did Second Chance have a devil, especially when Joker's Wild had one at the same time?[/quote]
From reading into what Mike Brockman, the man who was daytime head at each network the shows were picked up at, said during Stu Stoshak(sp?)'s interview a couple weeks back........ When Carruthers pitched him the idea of reviving SC in 1982, he was on board, except he wanted more flash and pizazz, and the focus to be more about the board (paraphrasing). He wanted the board to "come alive and be animated", in the thought that the show would appeal to children as well as their parents. Thus, the "Whammy" was born. Plus, in short, Second Chance is named after the Q&A, Press Your Luck is named after the board round.
Tyshaun
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My only exposure to the show is through Pilot #3 -- it's a nice show, and had a lot of what eventually came seven years later.
Jim Peck has always been a favorite host of mine, so he can do no wrong in my book.
So...you like Hot Seat and 3's A Crowd?
The buzz-in format of PYL was a little less fair to the contestants than the write-it-down system of of Q&A on SC.
I always thought that the "write-it-down" format was flawed, since it's usually obvious who had the correct answer the first time (if anybody did) and Jim usually began with the person who got the question right. Also, some contestants wrote an answer that wasn't one of the three given later on.
at some point they changed the $5000 space to an eggcrate readout that would randomly stop when the spinner did on some thousands of dollars, a change that appeared cheap. And was cheap, though perhaps necessarily so.
That was most likely after a contestant essentially predated Michael Larson. ABC paid for more patterns to be added to the board, and presumably changed Square #4 at this time. They probably changed the space in Round 1, too.
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[quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237020\' date=\'Mar 6 2010, 08:43 PM\']And Jim usually began with the person who got the question right.[/quote]
Not true. Based on the pilot, on the first question of each round, Jim began with the first player, on the second question, the second player, and on the third question, the third player.
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Just double-checked -- yeah, that's right. Sorry. :P
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That was most likely after a contestant essentially predated Michael Larson. ABC paid for more patterns to be added to the board, and presumably changed Square #4 at this time. They probably changed the space in Round 1, too.
Do we know for sure that this Second Chance Larsen incident really happened? Personally, I find it hard to believe. I would think if it really had happened, we would have heard something about it after all these years. Since Larson has been mentioned on a couple of game show specials and has been well-known, certainly somebody would have remembered the earlier incident - but no.
Urban legend?
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[quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' post=\'237074\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 12:37 PM\']Do we know for sure that this Second Chance Larsen incident really happened? Urban legend?[/quote]
At one of the homegrown GSCs, Jim Peck said someone pulled a Larson, winning over $70,000.
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At one of the homegrown GSCs, Jim Peck said someone pulled a Larson, winning over $70,000.
...Wow. I knew it was high, but not that high (I thought it was about $25-30K). Wasn't the limit on ABC at the time about $20,000 or so? Looking at this, is it any wonder that ABC paid for more patterns on a stopgap series?
/if it's spoken by the emcee or producer (who are the most likely to remember something like that), it's likely true
//if it's Chuck Barris, on the other hand...
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[quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237078\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 01:02 PM\']/If it's spoken by the emcee or producer (who are the most likely to remember something like that), it's likely true.[/quote]
Not quite...Bob Eubanks vehemently denied that the "In the butt" blooper ever happened for about 25 years.
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[quote name=\'MikeK\' post=\'237075\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 11:40 AM\'][quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' post=\'237074\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 12:37 PM\']Do we know for sure that this Second Chance Larsen incident really happened? Urban legend?[/quote]
At one of the homegrown GSCs, Jim Peck said someone pulled a Larson, winning over $70,000.
[/quote]
Can that really be attributed to pattern memorization, rather than a hell of a run of luck, though? That Second Chance board moved so fast, I would think that someone would have to have incomparable reflexes, along with some pretty high-speed brain power, to pull it off. The only way I could see that as feasible is if the board only had one pattern (Wiki, FWIW, says there were 9 at the outset), and even then, I think you'd need to have incredible trigger-finger reflexes to hit the big spaces with any consistency.
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Not quite...Bob Eubanks vehemently denied that the "In the butt" blooper ever happened for about 25 years.
Because he forgot about it, and the memories he was told were off.
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[quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237093\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 02:43 PM\']Because he forgot about it, and the memories he was told were off.[/quote]
Did you personally ask him?
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[quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237093\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 03:43 PM\'][quote name=\'fostergray82\' post=\'237081\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 01:16 PM\']...Bob Eubanks vehemently denied that the "In the butt" blooper ever happened for about 25 years.[/quote]
Because he forgot about it, and the memories he was told were off.
[/quote]
Or maybe he didn't want to be associated with such a crude urban legend. I'd think a punchline like that would be pretty difficult to forget, esp. when viewers constantly bring it up. Kinda like "She came on down and they came on out"...except THAT Bob was proud of that story.
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Or maybe he didn't want to be associated with such a crude urban legend. I'd think a punchline like that would be pretty difficult to forget, esp. when viewers constantly bring it up.
Quite possible, but he later offered $10,000 to anybody who could prove it happened.
Kinda like "She came on down and they came on out"...except THAT Bob was proud of that story.
Barker was even proud of his misunderstanding what was going on!
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[quote name=\'Sodboy13\' post=\'237089\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 02:21 PM\'][quote name=\'MikeK\' post=\'237075\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 11:40 AM\'][quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' post=\'237074\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 12:37 PM\']Do we know for sure that this Second Chance Larsen incident really happened? Urban legend?[/quote]
At one of the homegrown GSCs, Jim Peck said someone pulled a Larson, winning over $70,000.
[/quote]
Can that really be attributed to pattern memorization, rather than a hell of a run of luck, though? That Second Chance board moved so fast, I would think that someone would have to have incomparable reflexes, along with some pretty high-speed brain power, to pull it off. The only way I could see that as feasible is if the board only had one pattern (Wiki, FWIW, says there were 9 at the outset), and even then, I think you'd need to have incredible trigger-finger reflexes to hit the big spaces with any consistency.
[/quote]
Yeah, the board moved waaay too fast for somebody to win off skill, rather than luck. If I remember correctly, there were 3 devils on the board, so with a 5/6 chance of hitting a good square, chances are pretty good of avoiding it.
[quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237111\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 05:42 PM\'][quote name=\'fostergray82\' post=\'237109\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 05:41 PM\']Or maybe he didn't want to be associated with such a crude urban legend. I'd think a punchline like that would be pretty difficult to forget, esp. when viewers constantly bring it up.[/quote]
Quite possible, but he later offered $10,000 to anybody who could prove it happened.
[/quote]
Link? You've stated a lot of facts in this thread, but you aren't backing anything up.
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[quote name=\'MikeK\' post=\'237075\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 12:40 PM\'][quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' post=\'237074\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 12:37 PM\']Do we know for sure that this Second Chance Larsen incident really happened? Urban legend?[/quote]
At one of the homegrown GSCs, Jim Peck said someone pulled a Larson, winning over $70,000.[/quote]
With the qualifier that all I know of SC is via the Internet, I'm willing to consider this a small fish story.
Big win? Sure. $70k or pattern recognition? I dunno
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[quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237078\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 01:02 PM\'][quote name=\'MikeK\' post=\'237075\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 12:40 PM\']At one of the homegrown GSCs, Jim Peck said someone pulled a Larson, winning over $70,000.[/quote]
...Wow. I knew it was high, but not that high (I thought it was about $25-30K). Wasn't the limit on ABC at the time about $20,000 or so? Looking at this, is it any wonder that ABC paid for more patterns on a stopgap series?
/If it's spoken by the emcee or producer (who are the most likely to remember something like that), it's likely true.
//If it's Chuck Barris, on the other hand...
[/quote]
This to me is very interesting. Firstly, does anyone out there recall anymore information on this topic. And secondly, are there other people out there, like myself, who have never before heard of this pre-Larson Larson?
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[quote name=\'rollercoaster87\' post=\'237120\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 09:50 PM\'][quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237111\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 05:42 PM\']Quite possible, but he later offered $10,000 to anybody who could prove it happened.[/quote]
Link? You've stated a lot of facts in this thread, but you aren't backing anything up.
[/quote]
I know I'm not Dan, but here is what a quick search brought up.
http://www.snopes.com/radiotv/tv/newlywed.asp (http://\"http://www.snopes.com/radiotv/tv/newlywed.asp\")
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[quote name=\'Bill Neuweiler\' post=\'237124\' date=\'Mar 7 2010, 09:56 PM\']And secondly, are there other people out there, like myself, who have never before heard of this pre-Larson Larson?[/quote]
Yep; I'm one of them.
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Quite possible, but he later offered $10,000 to anybody who could prove it happened.
Link? You've stated a lot of facts in this thread, but you aren't backing anything up.
I know I'm not Dan, but here is what a quick search brought up.
http://www.snopes.com/radiotv/tv/newlywed.asp
Thank you. I remember hearing it from a trusted source -- I just forgot what it was. :(
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The only exposure I got of SC was a rather fuzzy one from the summer of 1977 I think it was. Since WPVI in Philly was carrying the news at noon, I was flipping through the channels & found WABC-TV 7 out of New York. The show was on at the time. Even though the picture was a bit fuzzy, I was able to make out the images of the game. The audio packages were simply amazing back then compared to what PYL had. The board was super speedy which made following the patterns very difficult to meorize.
And if there was a $70K winner, without actual video evidence to back it up(videotape wasn't really widespread in the late 70's), we'll just have to leave it as a "claim" for now.
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Press Your Luck only allowed a maximum of 20 spins total for each question round because only one player per question could score 3. On Second Chance, each player had the possibility of scoring 3 spins per question, or a maximum of 27 per question round. At least, on the pilot still existing, the board itself was static and the three Devils didn't jump around. Two of them were bunched together top left and the third was bottom right corner. Unfortunately, since I had to rely on good reception days to watch, I can't remember if the board did operate more like PYL toward the end. Anyway, given the chance to amass a large number of spins to start with, plus the chance of getting even more passed to you, it was possible that somebody could have reached $20-25K.
I know there were some changes made during the run. Aside from the previously mentioned square that could be anything between $1,000 and $5,000, bonus spins were introduced to the board (second round only I think). The spin displays went to 15, with the last three on the bottom row right indicating bonus spins. I know this because on the April 8 show (when I was in Georgia for my sister's wedding) one player already had 9 showing and was ambushed by another player who passed him 7 more, for a total of 16. I remember Jim mentioning that they had to put the 16th spin in the bonus spin area and it couldn't flash with the others. The contestant promptly managed to hit several Devils in quick succession and was gone taking 9 or 10 spins with him.
Other observations from re-watching the pilot -- the long version of the theme was used. At the end you hear it start the keyboard solo. Bumper music was from The Money Maze, sound effects came from the Double Dare/Card Sharks package.
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The spin displays went to 15, with the last three on the bottom row right indicating bonus spins.
I can provide proof of this -- a newspaper advert for the show's debut (on Game Show Utopia (http://www.gameshowutopia.net/sounds/erniemusic.htm)) has a picture of three contestants, presumably from the end of a show; the podiums have only 18 "spots" apiece.
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[quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237177\' date=\'Mar 8 2010, 08:48 PM\'][quote name=\'Mr. Bill\' post=\'237173\' date=\'Mar 8 2010, 07:31 PM\']The spin displays went to 15, with the last three on the bottom row right indicating bonus spins.[/quote]
I can provide proof of this -- a newspaper advert for the show's debut (on Game Show Utopia (http://\"http://www.gameshowutopia.net/sounds/erniemusic.htm\")) has a picture of three contestants, presumably from the end of a show; the podiums have only 18 "spots" apiece.
[/quote]
That shot's from the pilot. Another picture surfaced from the series (http://\"http://www.flickr.com/photos/41208947@N00/4418050215/\") that parallels what he's talking about.
-Jason
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[Picture from the series]
I knew there was another picture floating around somewhere, but I couldn't seem to find it. Thanks for the correction. :)
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[quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237186\' date=\'Mar 8 2010, 09:55 PM\']//Why is it that every time I think I do something great, I'm wrong?! Q_Q[/quote]
Relax. You're trying so hard to redeem yourself, blitzing every subject here. Just slow down and contribute when you need to. Both pictures had "only" 18 spaces. The series picture had them in three rows of 6, and jived with everything Mr. Bill said.
-Jason
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[quote name=\'JasonA1\' post=\'237184\' date=\'Mar 8 2010, 08:35 PM\'][quote name=\'Dan88\' post=\'237177\' date=\'Mar 8 2010, 08:48 PM\'][quote name=\'Mr. Bill\' post=\'237173\' date=\'Mar 8 2010, 07:31 PM\']The spin displays went to 15, with the last three on the bottom row right indicating bonus spins.[/quote]
I can provide proof of this -- a newspaper advert for the show's debut (on Game Show Utopia (http://\"http://www.gameshowutopia.net/sounds/erniemusic.htm\")) has a picture of three contestants, presumably from the end of a show; the podiums have only 18 "spots" apiece.
[/quote]
That shot's from the pilot. Another picture surfaced from the series (http://\"http://www.flickr.com/photos/41208947@N00/4418050215/\") that parallels what he's talking about.
-Jason
[/quote]
Thanks for sharing the picture, Jason. I've taken the liberty of downloading it to my library. :)
This shows some minor changes in the board layout from the pilot (the picture is from Round 2 but I would assume the position changes were also made for Round 1). One Devil stayed in its original position at #3. the second moved from #10 to #8, and the third from #17 to #14. While the Devil graphics remained the same, the prize slides were redone to a darker color with a bigger contrasting colored bow. Also notice that the big money $5000 space at #4 is now also marked Free Spin, corroborating my earlier statement. And, btw, the $2500 spot in #12 was moved to #17, with $1400 at #1.
Finally, it looks like this was taken after Round 2 ended judging from the positioning of Jim and the players in reference to the board. And if that's right, here's one of your biggest winners, if not the biggest, with a total of $26,545!
Again, Jason, thanks for the picture -- and you can call me just Bill. Somebody else had all the good user names, and I was a big Mr. Bill fan when he was on SNL. :)
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Every couple of years, this topic comes up, and I continue to live in a sense of regret and hope.
First, before I get to that, my knowledge of the mini-Larson run that I wrote on my site years ago (and I can only assume most everyone else got their info from) came from Randy when he was still with us. So for me, I only know as far as Mr. Amasia told me.
Now for the regret. I KNOW... there is a SC episode out there. I KNOW it exists. There's a girl in the Midwest who contacted me 9 years ago that says her dad was on the show, and still has a tape of his show. I have never been able to secure that tape for two reasons: 1) the first time, I was not able to round up what the girl wanted in exchange, and I lost contact, 2) I found the girl again on YouTube, and still have her name, but again, it's been a long time, and she lives far from her family now, so it's not immediately accessible.
It also doesn't help, of course, that the tape is likely beta. I know a former teacher I worked with that has all kinds of equipment to convert it, but I know that I would still have to get that master. NOT something I'm sure they'd be secure with if something goes wrong.
I wish I could offer more here. I'll try again soon. I hold no promises on success.
Update 5 minutes later: No sooner do I say it than it appears that the person in question no longer has their YouTube account. And naturally, I wasn't the only one asking to help convert. *sigh* Regret continues.
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[quote name=\'Neumms\' post=\'237000\' date=\'Mar 6 2010, 04:18 PM\']An observation--the Carruthers used the Whammy on PYL, and they'd used it on Beat the Odds. So why did Second Chance have a devil, especially when Joker's Wild had one at the same time?[/quote]
About four days late, but I didn't see a response to this: Joker's Wild was out of production in spring/summer 1977, when Second Chance aired (although it was rerunning on WOR in New York and on a local Los Angeles station).
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[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' post=\'237005\' date=\'Mar 6 2010, 03:49 PM\']It had a brighter feel to it than PYL. Turning set was cooler than PYL. Jim Peck has always been a favorite host of mine, so he can do no wrong in my book. On SC, the game was about hoping people would win, whereas on PYL, you were hoping people would lose, so you could see the cute animations. The buzz-in format of PYL was a little less fair to the contestants than the write-it-down system of of Q&A on SC. I also liked the music package of SC better.[/quote]
Seconded. It seemed like more suspense could be built on SC than PYL. The Whammy has a tendency to dampen the loss of a small fortune, whereas in that same 7 or 8 seconds on SC, I could see Jim Peck saying something poignant, even if it was a eulogy for the contestant's lost score.
One thing I noticed on the pilot pertaining to the Second Chance logo on the floor of the contestant island- the "Chance" part rises during the Big Board Round- you can see it at 10:49 on the first part of the pilot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39WU-9UO4LA...feature=related (http://\"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39WU-9UO4LA&feature=related\")
I kept playing it back because I couldn't tell- is that raised to show the scores and spins (like on PYL), or were there cameras down there to get contestant shots during the Big Board round? I didn't see any numbers down there, and that's why I'm suggesting the latter.
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[quote name=\'rollercoaster87\' post=\'237326\' date=\'Mar 11 2010, 01:43 AM\']I kept playing it back because I couldn't tell- is that raised to show the scores and spins (like on PYL), or were there cameras down there to get contestant shots during the Big Board round? I didn't see any numbers down there, and that's why I'm suggesting the latter.[/quote]
I would bet the farm on those being scoreboards a'la PYL. Even by the 80s, I don't think technology was sophisticated enough for good quality cameras to be in that sort of space. And really, the angles of the contestant spinning shots were nowhere close to coming from that area. They likely came from inside the board logo a'la PYL.
-Jason
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From what I remember about SC, I don't think there was ever a $70,000 winner, but there were definitely at least two $25,000+ one-day winners, and both were before the board changes. (I seem to recall that, in addition to replacing the "always $5000" space with a changing value (although the values changed in a fixed sequence, not "randomly"), the highest value space in the first round dropped from $1500 to $1000.)
I do remember one question from the show (and not from the pilot): "What is the best-selling novel of all time?" The question was asked right about the time Gone With the Wind was going to air on TV for the first time, so all three contestants ended up guessing GWTW, but the answer was Valley of the Dolls.
-- Don