Crosswords rule clarification

[JasonA1]

It's been a bit hard to grasp exactly what happens when a spoiler is wrong. Best I can tell, they're locked out from play until one (or both) of the others has a chance to spoil (i.e. buzz-in and talk). I would've thought it was just for the next clue, but over the past two days, a wrong spoiler has been locked out for two and even three clues after their mistake.

-Jason

[weaklink75]

[quote name=\'JasonA1\' post=\'163670\' date=\'Sep 13 2007, 01:43 PM\']
It's been a bit hard to grasp exactly what happens when a spoiler is wrong. Best I can tell, they're locked out from play until one (or both) of the others has a chance to spoil (i.e. buzz-in and talk). I would've thought it was just for the next clue, but over the past two days, a wrong spoiler has been locked out for two and even three clues after their mistake.

-Jason
[/quote]


IIRC, the rule is if a Spoiler is wrong, they're locked out until either another Spoiler is successful and switches with a front player or all three Spoilers are locked out. Then they re-enter play.

[Patrick S]

Close but not quite.  The spoiler is blocked until any other spoiler gets a guess.  They don't have to get it right.  For example, if spoiler #1 is locked out, and on the next question spoiler #2 guesses incorrectly, spoiler #2 will be locked out, but #1 will be back in.

[parliboy]

[quote name=\'Patrick S\' post=\'163749\' date=\'Sep 13 2007, 09:08 PM\'] Close but not quite.  The spoiler is blocked until any other spoiler gets a guess.  They don't have to get it right.  For example, if spoiler #1 is locked out, and on the next question spoiler #2 guesses incorrectly, spoiler #2 will be locked out, but #1 will be back in. [/quote]

Then please explain those circumstances under which two spoilers have been locked out at the same time?

[Matt Ottinger]

[quote name=\'Patrick S\' post=\'163749\' date=\'Sep 13 2007, 10:08 PM\']
Close but not quite.  The spoiler is blocked until any other spoiler gets a guess.  They don't have to get it right.  For example, if spoiler #1 is locked out, and on the next question spoiler #2 guesses incorrectly, spoiler #2 will be locked out, but #1 will be back in.[/quote]
Sorry to look like I'm piling on, Patrick, but it would be helpful to know whether this is something you know as fact (and in which case HOW you know it), or whether this is something you THINK is true from watching the show like the rest of us.  Because if you're going to make what appears to be a statement of absolute certainty, and also tell somebody else "Close but not quite", you'd better be damned sure YOU'RE right.  And if parliboy is right that there have been two spoilers locked out at the same time, then you're wrong.

[SRIV94]

[quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' post=\'163757\' date=\'Sep 13 2007, 10:02 PM\']
And if parliboy is right that there have been two spoilers locked out at the same time, then you're wrong.
[/quote]
Just in case, a little spoiler space.  While this should go in "Show Summaries", it is germaine to the discussion here.


S
O

H
O
W
'
S

Y
O
U
R

D
A
Y
?










OK, enough.

Well, on the second ep of the double-run today, two spoilers were locked out at the same time, but both missed the same question and never were able to get back in the game (and the third was a complete ditz who should have been rejected as a contestant at the front desk).  So Patrick isn't necessarily "wrong" although it's not confirmed whether or not he's right.

[Brandon Brooks]

I have, for a fact, seen two spoilers locked out, though I don't know the circumstances surrounding.  However, all three spoilers will never be locked out at one time.  In the episode I saw, as soon at the third was going to be locked out, they unlocked them all.

[peiboy91]

Right at the end of this Youtube clip, after a spoiler gets an answer wrong Ty tells her that she's locked out until "the other two spoilers get an opportunity to answer."

[parliboy]

[quote name=\'peiboy91\' post=\'163762\' date=\'Sep 13 2007, 10:29 PM\'] Right at the end of this Youtube clip, after a spoiler gets an answer wrong Ty tells her that she's locked out until "the other two spoilers get an opportunity to answer." [/quote]
And at about 4:30 into part 2 of that show, we see a second spoiler locked on a clue separate from the one the first was locked out on.  (This kills Patrick's theory.)

So thanks for demonstrating the horrible way they're having Ty explain that rule and leading us toward finding the right answer.

[tvwxman]

Holy crap my head hurts.

It's been told by Merv that he came up with the idea for the format in a dream, and called the EP in the middle of the night with the suggestion. Gawd only knows what else Merv was thinking about in bed.

/Regarding game shows, you sickos.
//And early 80's dance shows too.

[clemon79]

[quote name=\'tvwxman\' post=\'163793\' date=\'Sep 14 2007, 01:49 AM\']
It's been told by Merv that he came up with the idea for the format in a dream, and called the EP in the middle of the night with the suggestion.[/quote]
Which makes me wonder, if what we're seeing is that very same complete format, or if it got tweaked out from under him, or if he just had the basic idea of "crossword clues for money" and someone else took it from there.

Because, thinking about it, let's look at Merv's track record for successful game show formats:

• A straight quizzer with a backwards-gimmick.
• Hangman for money.

That's basically it. Yes, those two were wildly successful, but Mark Goodson or Bob Stewart he ain't.

[uncamark]

[quote name=\'clemon79\' post=\'163831\' date=\'Sep 14 2007, 01:22 PM\']
[quote name=\'tvwxman\' post=\'163793\' date=\'Sep 14 2007, 01:49 AM\']
It's been told by Merv that he came up with the idea for the format in a dream, and called the EP in the middle of the night with the suggestion.[/quote]
Which makes me wonder, if what we're seeing is that very same complete format, or if it got tweaked out from under him, or if he just had the basic idea of "crossword clues for money" and someone else took it from there.

Because, thinking about it, let's look at Merv's track record for successful game show formats:

• A straight quizzer with a backwards-gimmick.
• Hangman for money.

That's basically it. Yes, those two were wildly successful, but Mark Goodson or Bob Stewart he ain't.
[/quote]

And I humbly submit that once Bob Stewart left the cocoon of Goodson and Todman, he had exactly one very successful format--"Password" twisted and tweaked with Mo' Money.  (Which is not knocking "Pyramid" at all, but its roots do show.)

(Two cable runs for "Chain Reaction" and a cable and brief syndication run for "Jackpot!" don't count.)

And "Concentration" and "Winky Dink" aside, Jack Barry and Dan Enright basically reworked two ideas (panel show with participants Barry could talk down to and Q&A with gimmick scoring and beat-the-bad-guy end game) over and over (and I realize that "Winky Dink" and "Juvenile Jury/Life Begins at 80" aren't game shows).  In fact, is there anyone other than Goodson who had more than two multi-decade, part of the common culture hits?

[The Ol' Guy]

Preach it, Rev. Lemon!
As once stated, if I counted them correctly, Merv has roughly a win/loss record of 2 and 9. Haven't seen Crosswords yet, but plan to tape it Monday. I really hope it works, but yes - Merv and Mark have very different home run records.

Just caught Uncamark's post. No one's immune from re-duplication. One could say Headline Chasers and Let's Play Post Office shared famous people and events. Jeopardy, Reach For The Stars, Click, and Memory Game were Q&A variations. Word for Word, Wheel, CrossWords and Monopoly were variants on classic games. Haven't seen Ruckus, but could there be elements that were also in Reach For The Stars (quizzes, action and stunts?)
Now where would one put One In A Million? In my own warped way, I personally think any project that can make it through the hassles of initial pitches, development, audience testing and network nabobs and still make it on-air is somewhat of a success just by beating the odds. Whether the public agrees is another story. So based on that, I still lean toward the king of duplication, Mark G., as the winner.

[Ian Wallis]

I'll also admit that Goodson was the winner - but how many times did they re-work the idea of the panel show over and over, especially in the early going?

[uncamark]

[quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' post=\'163958\' date=\'Sep 15 2007, 10:53 PM\']
I'll also admit that Goodson was the winner - but how many times did they re-work the idea of the panel show over and over, especially in the early going?
[/quote]

According to Maxene Fabe:

GOODSON (in lobby):  Can't anyone come up with any new ideas?

BOB STEWART:  I can--and I'm your next appointment.

Yeah, they reworked it over and over--but so was everyone else.  It's G-T's "WML?" and "IGAS" we remember, while "Masquerade Party" and many lesser creations are simply Brooks and Marsh material (and Bob Stewart's "TTTT" twisted the panel show format, even if he may've stolen it from John Guedel).