the problem with TPiR brand-less prizes..

[lobster]

on the latest MDS in the Showcase one of the prizes was a trip for two to Las Vegas (for SIX freakin' nights), but the sponsor was "Vegas.com" and there was no mention of the hotel..  

This isn't the same as featuring an unbranded no-name refrigerator; if the contestant was actually trying to price this out in their head, knowing the hotel is a significant part of the cost in a trip to Vegas, as it makes a huge difference where yer stayin'... If it were six nights at Circus Circus that'd be worth about $270, and if it were six nights at the Wynn Las Vegas it'd be worth about $3000..  And although people probably concern themselves with the ARP of the last/biggest prize in the showcase to estimate their bid, we're talking about a million bucks for coming in by a whole thousand, so every bit you can estimate helps if you really want to try to take an educated stab at it..

"Six nights in Vegas" just seemed to be tremendously vague under the circumstances..

If the contestant were to have asked Rich "What hotel is that?" would he just say "we're just not given that information, sorry.."?

[JasonA1]

That sort of thing has happened before. Contestants will ask for information on the small prizes, and Rich will just repeat the generic plug he was given.

Another example that doesn't seem to phase people is the lack of package size in a grocery item's description. Obviously, the contestants can walk up to the item and see for themselves, but it has a lot to do with the price, and it's not in the description. Same thing goes for computers; I'm certain something that would make the price different to an avid computer shopper isn't mentioned in the copy 99% of the time.

Obviously, the show cares more about the plug than the specifics required to play the game. And rightfully so, I might add.

-Jason

[davemackey]

Think of how exhaustively detailed Don Pardo's prize descriptions were on the original "Price". He could take up to a minute and a half to give all pertinent details of a prize.

Rich Fields is lucky if he's given 15 seconds to do the same. There's simply not enough time in the format to allow that, generic prizes or no.

[lobster]

[quote name=\'davemackey\' post=\'180606\' date=\'Mar 9 2008, 05:33 AM\']
Rich Fields is lucky if he's given 15 seconds to do the same. There's simply not enough time in the format to allow that, generic prizes or no.
[/quote]

..how much longer would it have taken him to add "..at the Las Vegas Flamingo" to "a six night stay"?  I'm not saying he should go into detail about the fabulous gaming facilities and 24 hour steakhouse, just the freakin name of the hotel..  Again, this comes down to being able to price the prize, and that's just not possible to do if you're not given the essential key in this prize, which really is the hotel.  I'm just saying -- how do they expect you to estimate the price?

Certainly just saying "a new car!" without giving the make and model to save time wouldn't make much sense.. how is it different with smaller prizes?

[JasonA1]

[quote name=\'lobster\' post=\'180618\' date=\'Mar 9 2008, 12:14 PM\']Certainly just saying "a new car!" without giving the make and model to save time wouldn't make much sense.. how is it different with smaller prizes?[/quote]

Why give unsponsored items free time? That's why they dropped the brand names from unpaid grocery plugs a few years back. They don't do it with cars, assumedly, because it'd be ridiculous to dance around what make and model it is when it's readily verifiable by eye. But giving GE a free plug to describe a cordless phone isn't necessary. If the hotel didn't furnish the prize - no plug.

-Jason

[Jimmy Owen]

But they give the unsponsored items face time, so the manufacturer gets free advertising anyway.

[joker316]

If I were a contestant on TPIR and my showcase had a trip from "NWA vacations", my thought would be to price a "packaged trip or tour from an agency" as opposed to separating the airfare, hotels, meals, etc. It would be the same thought behind a generic computer prize from "Best Buy"; you would guess what BB would sell the computer for instead of the MSRP.

And, about the grocery items, Jay Stewart on LMAD always said "This is a 28 ounce jar of Ragu" during pricing deals. He would always mention the size of an item, while TPIR rarely did in the past and never seems to do now.

And lastly, on 3-7-08 TPIR MDS, how did the producers feel about Drew calling the loss on "It's In The Bag" as "the oxi-Clean incident" when they didn't pay for a plug! Must have LOVED that!

[Matt Ottinger]

[quote name=\'joker316\' post=\'180627\' date=\'Mar 9 2008, 01:47 PM\']
If I were a contestant on TPIR and my showcase had a trip from "NWA vacations", my thought would be to price a "packaged trip or tour from an agency" as opposed to separating the airfare, hotels, meals, etc. It would be the same thought behind a generic computer prize from "Best Buy"; you would guess what BB would sell the computer for instead of the MSRP.[/quote]
I don't think you see the point.  If, to use your example, they offered a generic computer prize from BestBuy, your problem is that there are many, many different computers that BestBuy sells.  Is it an e-Machine from BestBuy, or is it a Sony Vaio from BestBuy?  There's a thousand dollar difference in the two.  I'm sure vacation packagers offer a variety of packages at a variety of prices.  Which one do they mean?

You would also be wrong to try and guess what BestBuy is selling the computer for, as opposed to the MSRP.  Even when they go generic, TPIR always uses the MSRP.

The question is whether you think of TPIR as a 'serious' (there's a better word, I'm sure) game that tests pricing skills, or as a fun guessing game with a handful of strategies but no real expectation that contestants actually know the right answers.

[clemon79]

[quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' post=\'180628\' date=\'Mar 9 2008, 11:00 AM\']
You would also be wrong to try and guess what BestBuy is selling the computer for, as opposed to the MSRP.  Even when they go generic, TPIR always uses the MSRP.[/quote]
Hell, a lot of the time, Best Buy doesn't know what Best Buy is selling the computer for.

The question is whether you think of TPIR as a 'serious' (there's a better word, I'm sure) game that tests pricing skills, or as a fun guessing game with a handful of strategies but no real expectation that contestants actually know the right answers.

There is an easy and short flowchart that can be used to determine what side of the fence many users come down on about this issue. I'll leave figuring out what that flowchart looks like as an exercise to the reader.

[joker316]

[quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' post=\'180628\' date=\'Mar 9 2008, 02:00 PM\']

The question is whether you think of TPIR as a 'serious' (there's a better word, I'm sure) game that tests pricing skills, or as a fun guessing game with a handful of strategies but no real expectation that contestants actually know the right answers.
[/quote]
Maybe I am jaded, and I do see your point Matt, but I always thought there was some element of "seriousness" mixed in with the fun guessing game aspect. And God only knows where I will fall on Chris' flowchart.

[Casey]

[quote name=\'joker316\' post=\'180635\' date=\'Mar 9 2008, 12:42 PM\']
Maybe I am jaded, and I do see your point Matt, but I always thought there was some element of "seriousness" mixed in with the fun guessing game aspect. And God only knows where I will fall on Chris' flowchart.
[/quote]
There definitely was in the 60s.  There was to a decent extent in the 70s and early 80s.  As for now, almost all seriousness is gone and has been replaced with circus antics.

[lobster]

[quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' post=\'180628\' date=\'Mar 9 2008, 01:00 PM\']
The question is whether you think of TPIR as a 'serious' (there's a better word, I'm sure) game that tests pricing skills, or as a fun guessing game with a handful of strategies but no real expectation that contestants actually know the right answers.
[/quote]

Exactly -- and normally I don't think most contestants take TPiR that seriously, nor should they -- since I think contestants normally just strive to bid well enough to *win* and, hell, if they hack the double showcase by chance, more power to 'em -- but that's for any normal daytime TPiR ep.  The difference here is, here we have an instance where a MILLION BUCKS is on the line, so if the contestant truly is excited about that prospect and they want to try to win the million dollars, knowing more detail about the prizes to try to zone in on that thousand-dollar range is essential .. and trying to price the showcase well (if you have some level of knowledge in pricing values of prizes) is made virtually impossible with such vague descriptions.. rendering it more of a "guess" than an "educated guess"

[Jimmy Owen]

My favorite item given away on Cullen TPIR was "The Thinker."  That may have required a guess of some sort, since there weren't that many of them.

[Steve Gavazzi]

[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' post=\'180647\' date=\'Mar 9 2008, 04:39 PM\']My favorite item given away on Cullen TPIR was "The Thinker."  That may have required a guess of some sort, since there weren't that many of them.[/quote]
Some days, there aren't that many on the current version, either. :-)

[TLEberle]

[quote name=\'clemon79\' post=\'180631\' date=\'Mar 9 2008, 11:35 AM\']There is an easy and short flowchart that can be used to determine what side of the fence many users come down on about this issue. I'll leave figuring out what that flowchart looks like as an exercise to the reader.[/quote]But Jeopardy! couldn't get away with an ambiguous clue, nor Wheel of Fortune a misspelling in their puzzle. Why should TPIR be any different?

A contestant going on Jeopardy! or Millionaire might try to expand his or her knowledge base by studying encyclopedias or magazines. A prospective TPIR contestant might spend a few days shopping around Los Angeles before bivouacking at Beverly and Fairfax. There's no difference between the two.

The show may want to look at itself as a carnival of fun, with all that description entails, but they're still playing a game at the end of the day. They shouldn't be able to leave out options on a car, which hotel they'll use as part of a trip package, or brand names when there's a disparity within that particular piece of merchandise. If that means they have to give a plug to a company that didn't pay for it, T.S.