12/06 Schedule Changes

[FeudDude]

http://adlink.com/resource_center/programm...04&endtime=1770

The WPPA poker tournament makes its debut that week, with some 5 airings - two each on Monday and Saturday, and one on Thursday.

Also, interestingly enough, the 8 pm Tuesday and midnight Saturday airings of Millionaire will be pre-empted in favor of Celebrity Blackjack and WPPA poker, respectively.  This means that GSN actually won't be airing Millionaire at all that Saturday.  No big loss for me, but definetely worth noting.

[The Pyramids]

You know, this December line-up will make it almost a year since the profesors odd, GSN -will -never be- the-  same- again breaking story.

I know that the future of the network is always a question mark and for short time in the summer the line-up was indeed pretty bad. Still I think right now time has shown that the sky-is-falling predictions people had late last year were off the mark.

[cmjb13]

Wonder if we'll get the Betty White Xmas marathon this year?

[Chelsea Thrasher]

They haven't used THAT marathon in three years. Somehow, I doubt it's making it's return...

[CaseyAbell]

The Prof notes that the Dog Eat Dog marathon November 14 has been replaced by a Dodgeball marathon. This change hasn't shown up on Adlink yet, but it doesn't surprise me. The Dog has suffered ridiculous rerun abuse.

Looks like Dodgeball must be getting pretty good numbers. As a thread on the Big Board noted, the second season rule changes have created a faster, more entertaining game. The Prof dumps on Dodgeball as "trashsport," which is another strong indication the show must be doing something right.

The World Poker Players Association is a tiny startup operation. Its web site mentions the GSN show in the forum section. Sounds like GSN is doing a one-shot, low-budget deal to see how poker plays (sorry for the bad puns).

[aaron sica]

[quote name=\'CaseyAbell\' date=\'Oct 23 2004, 02:59 PM\']
Looks like Dodgeball must be getting pretty good numbers. As a thread on the Big Board noted, the second season rule changes have created a faster, more entertaining game.

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I've never seen the show, but based on the feedback I'm reading about the second season, perhaps it might be worth my while to watch an episode..

[Matt Ottinger]

[quote name=\'PaulD\' date=\'Oct 23 2004, 12:54 PM\']You know, this December line-up will make it almost a year since the profesors odd, GSN -will -never be- the-  same- again breaking story.[/quote]

In Steve's defense, and at the risk of stirring up what is obviously a very emotional issue for a lot of you, I think he was correct to report that GSN was turning a major corner and would, in all likelihood, never be the same again.  Whether it's better or worse than it was before is the subject of endless debate, but GSN as a haven made up exclusively of old reruns and traditional, Q&A originals really is no more.  Their choice to let Bob Boden go (a second time) was the best indication that they wanted to go in a new direction.

For a lot of us who followed the station from the beginning, it no longer feels like "our" GSN anymore.  I understand that.  But since the station is doing better now than it ever has, and seems to continue to be on the upswing, the "doom and gloom" prophesies are beginning to look a little silly.

[CaseyAbell]

...GSN as a haven made up exclusively of old reruns and traditional, Q&A originals really is no more.

Really? The shows for today, Monday 10/25:

Star Search, Hollywood Showdown, Jeopardy, Match Game, All New 3's a Crap, Newlywed Game, Love Connection, Friend or Foe, Whammy, Family Feud, Russian Roulette, Lingo, Win Ben Stein's Money, Weakest Link, Who Wants to be a Millionaire, Street Smarts, Name's the Same, What's My Line.

Except for Star Search, it looks like...old game show reruns and traditional originals. I'm not a big fan of all these shows, but the lineup looks about as traditional as it did before Mr. Steve started his post-Boden fulminations. Okay, later in the week we get Dodgeball and a glimpse of Spy TV. But the schedule remains overwhelmingly dominated by traditional game shows.

Which is the problem with Mr. Steve's critique of GSN. It doesn't survive contact with the network's actual schedule. You can either believe GSN's schedule of almost nothing but traditional game shows, or you can believe the Prof's columns about how GSN is abandoning traditional game shows. But it's really, really hard to believe both at once.

The Prof is starting to sound like the Wizard of Oz when he tells us to pay no attention to that schedule in front of our eyes. I know he's still upset about Boden, but that's no reason to disconnect from the real world.

[melman1]

So, Casey - I guess Dsmith's comments in that other thread had absolutely no impact on you at all?  Gave you nothing to think about?

The point he was trying to make (in a misguided way, I'll admit) is that you seem to scan every post for even the slightest criticism of GSN... so you can respond with your usual litany of reasons why "everything's great" in your eyes.  Ususally including, but not limited to, a recitation of the current lineup, ratings and statistics, various slams against The Perfesser, your likes and dislikes, and what you've posted on other forums about the matter.  Never concise, and usually not very relevant to the general drift of the thread.

As Dsmith said in part, "people should be able to express their opinions" and "your usual defense of them doesn't come as a surprise".  I for one would appreciate it if you could block this reflex you seem to have toward making these sorts of posts EVERY TIME the topic of GSN programming is touched upon.

[dzinkin]

[quote name=\'CaseyAbell\' date=\'Oct 25 2004, 09:08 AM\']

...GSN as a haven made up exclusively of old reruns and traditional, Q&A originals really is no more.

Really? The shows for today, Monday 10/25:

Star Search, Hollywood Showdown, Jeopardy, Match Game, All New 3's a Crap, Newlywed Game, Love Connection, Friend or Foe, Whammy, Family Feud, Russian Roulette, Lingo, Win Ben Stein's Money, Weakest Link, Who Wants to be a Millionaire, Street Smarts, Name's the Same, What's My Line.

Except for Star Search, it looks like...old game show reruns and traditional originals.

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[/quote]
To put "Win Ben Stein's Money," "Weakest Link," "Who Wants to Be a Millionaire," and "Street Smarts" in the category of "old" requires one to stretch the definition of "old" beyond the point where most of GSN's critics here define it.  Matt was talking about reruns of the vintage GSN showed in the early days of the network -- not something that was in first run just a few months or years ago.  But then, you knew that before you typed a single word.

Taking the contrarian view for the sole purpose of taking the contrarian view -- as you also do when you defend the GSN boards -- is fine, but it would be nice if you'd occasionally admit that that's exactly what you're doing.  I'm not going to defend those who say that you're not allowed to have your own opinion or to back up that opinion with statistics (especially when said critics resort to ad hominem attacks in lieu of actual arguments), but I also know for certain that if the rest of the board were perfectly happy with GSN as it is, you'd be the one criticizing it... just to be different, and just to get a rise out of people.

[Matt Ottinger]

[quote name=\'CaseyAbell\' date=\'Oct 25 2004, 09:08 AM\']

...GSN as a haven made up exclusively of old reruns and traditional, Q&A originals really is no more.

Really? The shows for today, Monday 10/25:

Star Search, Hollywood Showdown, Jeopardy, Match Game, All New 3's a Crap, Newlywed Game, Love Connection, Friend or Foe, Whammy, Family Feud, Russian Roulette, Lingo, Win Ben Stein's Money, Weakest Link, Who Wants to be a Millionaire, Street Smarts, Name's the Same, What's My Line.

Except for Star Search, it looks like...old game show reruns and traditional originals. [/quote]
Actually, no.  Not even close.  And the fact that you can't see that makes me begin to wonder if you really are just trying to be argumentative.

Not a single item on that list is an original, except in the broadest definition that everything was original at one time.  Some of them are reruns of originals that were part of GSN before the change we're talking about.  GSN is currently not creating "traditional" originals, and that was one of my points.

My other was specifically referring to "old reruns".  I realize that you've arbitrarily decided not to recognize the term "classic" and you define any rerun as "old", but surely you can recognize the difference between reruns of recent shows and the sort of reruns that were a part of GSN in the early years.  Only four of the shows you list have significant age to them, and two of them are seen in the middle of the night.

Yes, Casey, GSN aired game shows back then and they air game shows now.  Game show fans can find plenty to enjoy.  However, GSN is different now than it was then.  Not as dramatically different as some would say, but it is different.  There are people who preferred it the old way.  I'm not even saying that I'm one of them, but to not even acknowledge the differences seriously over-simplifies your arguments.

[CaseyAbell]

So, Casey - I guess Dsmith's comments in that other thread had absolutely no impact on you at all? Gave you nothing to think about?

They must have given Dsmith something to think about, because he apologized for his intemperate language on the Behind the Scenes board.

The point he was trying to make (in a misguided way, I'll admit) is that you seem to scan every post for even the slightest criticism of GSN... so you can respond with your usual litany of reasons why "everything's great" in your eyes.

No, I respond with the facts about the current schedule. I notice you don't refute any of the facts, because you can't. The schedule is what it is.

Do I like everything on the current schedule? Not at all. You might have noticed my mention of "All New 3's a Crap." Should have been a tipoff that the show, in my opinion, is an abomination - braindead contestants, stupid questions, stupider answers, and a host who looks stoned most of the time, though I can't blame him.

This probably constitutes "defending GSN" in your view.

I also don't like Friend or Foe, which is mean-spirited, slow and dull. And I haven't been shy about expressing this opinion several times here and on the GSN board.

This probably constitutes "defending GSN" in your view, too.

Although it's (thankfully) not on today's sched, Card Sharks is a dull and simplistic game that's somehow gotten stuck on the GSN schedule forever. Hollywood Squares looks rehearsed and pre-arranged because so much of it is rehearsed and pre-arranged. It's another "classic" that should bite the dust.

This probably constitutes "defending GSN" in your view, again.

Said it on the other thread, and I'll say it here. If GSN does something I like, I say so. If GSN does something I don't like, I say so.

[CaseyAbell]

Some of them are reruns of originals that were part of GSN before the change we're talking about. GSN is currently not creating "traditional" originals, and that was one of my points.

In fact, I think Celeb Blackjack is every bit as traditional a game show as anything else GSN has created. You've noted the similarity to the panel shows of the fifties and sixties. If anything Celeb Blackjack puts far more emphasis on the gameplay than, say, IGaS.

I realize that the Prof can't allow Blackjack to be considered a traditional game show because it destroys his argument that GSN isn't creating traditional game shows any more. But that doesn't mean I have to accept the Prof's arbitrary creation of a "casino game" genre to exclude Blackjack from the hallowed halls of game-show-dom.

My other was specifically referring to "old reruns". I realize that you've arbitrarily decided not to recognize the term "classic" and you define any rerun as "old", but surely you can recognize the difference between reruns of recent shows and the sort of reruns that were a part of GSN in the early years.

Today you've got reruns of Match Game, Family Feud, Love Connection, Name's the Same, and What's My Line. These shows all have some pretty serious age on them. On other days you get Card Sharks, Blockbusters, Beat the Clock. How old does a show have to be?

I haven't heard any definition of "classic" that doesn't sound arbitrary. The shows I mentioned above all meet the arbitrary criterion of "at least ten years old or so" that another poster used. There's obviously no reason for the ten-year cutoff - as opposed to a five-year or a twenty-year or an any-year definition. But even by the ten-year standard, GSN shows many hours of classics each week.

I'm not trying to be argumentative. I'm just pointing out what's actually on GSN's current schedule. As I mentioned in the previous post, I don't like some of what's on the schedule, but it sure looks like traditional game shows almost all the time, including many hours of older shows.

[CaseyAbell]

To put "Win Ben Stein's Money," "Weakest Link," "Who Wants to Be a Millionaire," and "Street Smarts" in the category of "old" requires one to stretch the definition of "old" beyond the point where most of GSN's critics here define it.

Some Regis Millionaire eps date from more than five years ago, as do many of the WBSM episodes. Is that old enough? I don't know. As I said in the previous post, it gets pretty arbitrary as to where you place the magic line of "oldness" for game shows. They certainly are traditional game shows, like almost everything else on GSN's current schedule.

I also know for certain that if the rest of the board were perfectly happy with GSN as it is, you'd be the one criticizing it... just to be different, and just to get a rise out of people.

How could you know this for "certain"? Believe it or not, I don't believe in just being different to get a rise out of people. I really don't care if people get a rise or not. (This is not a reference to Viagra.)

What I do care for is being as objective as possible in evaluating GSN or anything else. If somebody says something about GSN's schedule, I think the best way to discuss the issue is to...look at GSN's actual schedule. You know, what they're showing RIGHT NOW!, as Fox would say.

If this gets a rise out of people, I'm honestly sorry. But - and I'm not trying to get into a spitting match - what other approach would you suggest?

[zachhoran]

Casey said:

Some Regis Millionaire eps date from more than five years ago, as do many of the WBSM episodes.

Zach said:
 
The WBSM shows seen thus far are from 1998, and the August 1999 Regis MIllionaire episodes are yet to be shown on GSN. THe earliest they have shown are from November 1999's series of shows. WHen they went back after showing the January 2001 episodes, they went back to January 2000.