To pre-empt, or not to pre-empt

[trainman]

[quote name=\'SRIV94\' date=\'Sep 15 2005, 12:30 PM\']But WBBM's one-day delaying of CBS' morning offerings from 1/4/82 to summer 1986 didn't make sense--as they were shown later than their network feeds...

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Maybe they were worried about the ability of their master control operators to successfully perform the "delay" operations, and they wanted a one-day cushion just in case someone forgot to hit "record" and they had to request a refeed from CBS, or whatever.

[Terry K]

I'm pretty sure KCNC  runs GL at 9 respectively.  
I know WCBS does take GL at 10am local time before TPIR, so I am beginning to wonder if GL might not be fed out by the network in that hour.  (I dont' have access to a CBS feed chart to know this for sure, but its a suspicion)

Remember, there is NO Mountain time zone feed of CBS, so KCNC either has to delay out the previous day's feed or take an early feed.  Considering WBBM also does take it as 9 am local time as well

[aaron sica]

[quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Sep 16 2005, 03:13 AM\']I know WCBS does take GL at 10am local time before TPIR, so I am beginning to wonder if GL might not be fed out by the network in that hour.  (I dont' have access to a CBS feed chart to know this for sure, but its a suspicion)

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I don't think it's too bad a suspicion, considering I can think of at least  two other CBS stations that air GL at 10am (KYW in Philly, WYOU in Scranton). Among other oddities, (and it's the only one on the East Coast I know of that does this), WRAL in Raleigh airs Y&R from 4pm-5pm.

[Ian Wallis]

I remember going to my grandparents' house in northern PA over Christmas breaks. They live in McKean County, which is interestingly enough in the Buffalo, NY DMA. So WGRZ there aired a lot of shows I never saw anywhere else

I was never fond of the Buffalo stations.  There were a lot of pre-emptions on those stations - especially in the late '70s.  The original "Card Sharks" wasn't picked up by WGRZ until well into the first year of its run.  "All-Star Secrets" was never aired on that station.  WKBW, the ABC station, never ran the 12 noon show after 1976, meaning the last few months of "Let's Make a Deal" and the last couple years of "$20,000 Pyramid" were never carried.

Some of those shows did come into the area on International Cable - one of those stations picked up a distant feed.

As a game show fan, the worst thing WGRZ did occured in spring 1976.  They were carrying a 60-minute version of "Dinah" at 9, followed by the NBC lineup at 10.  All of a sudden one week they started airing a 90-minute version of "Dinah", taking out "Celebrity Sweepstakes" in the process.  It was still carried in Rochester, but we didn't get Rochester added to our cable until the late '70s.  Luckily, when NBC moved "Sweepstakes" to 10:30 in the summer we got it back, as "Sanford and Son" reruns were then blocked out.

In the '80s, we never got "Just Men" or "The New Battlestars".  So I was never able to see the episodes of "Battlestars" that I saw in person.  

In August 1985, WIVB, the CBS station picked up "Sally Jesse Raphael" at 10:30 - so they went from "Pyramid" to "Raphael" (and at that time I never even knew who she was) to "Price".  Kind of an odd placement for the talk show.  Luckily, "Press Your Luck" was still available on a Toronto station - that is until CBS changed the time slot in January 1986!

[SRIV94]

[quote name=\'trainman\' date=\'Sep 16 2005, 12:28 AM\']Maybe they were worried about the ability of their master control operators to successfully perform the "delay" operations, and they wanted a one-day cushion just in case someone forgot to hit "record" and they had to request a refeed from CBS, or whatever.

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You could be on to something.  Although, with two chances to get TPiR same-day (feed at 10AM CT for the East/Midwest/South and 12N CT for the West Coast), theoretically TPiR didn't necessarily have to be delayed by a day (since they were showing it at 3PM).

Personally, what I would've done is kept TPiR at 10AM CT with the rest of the network and delay CBS' 9AM/9:30 CT offerings to after the sudsers (and again, you'd have two chances to get those offerings for same-day airing).

Doug -- and the countdown to 1500 continues

[tvwxman]

I posted this to Alt-TV-GS Back in July 1997.....regarding the Miami GS Scene, which, back in the day, sucked....

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I can't speak for the seventies, for i moved to South Florida in 1978,
but I can personally attest to the LACK of network games that South
Florida affiliates would show.....I remember taking family vacations
back to New York (where I'm from) and not wanting to go do anything at
all if it interfered with a game show that i could not watch at
home......

For years the NBC affil (at the time, WCKT/WSVN 7) rarely aired any
10:30 am shows, nor did any Noon shows air because of the news.....this
means we never saw Go!, Just Men, the New Battlestars, the New
Blockbusters, Super Password, Hot Potato, or the 1st few years of Sale
of the Century.....they also did not air Wordplay, Scrabble (when it
took over the 12:30pm spot from Wordplay), or Match Game/Hollywood
Squares Hour, but thankfully the cable at the time picked up the West
Palm Beach affil , WPTV5, and they did air those....

In addition, the CBS affil (again, at the time WTVJ4), never aired Child
's Play, Press Your Luck, or new Card Sharks) and for many years didn't
air Pyramid at 10am....what made it worse was for a few years, they
would opt to run reruns of the Big Valley instead!

Slowly, they would trot out more network stuff, and when the
affiliations switched around at the beginning of 1989, everybody aired
everything, with the exception of Super Password (News was and continues
to be big in Miami!)

we did see our share of Syndie games, for that 's what both channels for
a while aired in place of the network games, which always seemed wierd
to me (preempting a game for another one, which in most cases was, a
weaker one! Strike it Rich, new Break the Bank, new Crosswits)....at
least the affils (channel 4 in particular) did air nighttime Card Sharks
and nighttime Sale of the Century, which meant us die hards did get some
fix of a show we couldn't see in the mornings!

Also, as far as the $20,000 Pyramid was concerned, I don't remember WPLG
airing the daytime version, but I do remember them airing the $25000
pyramid with Bill Cullen every Saturday night at 7:30 (going up against
Hee Haw and Sha Na Na!) for a time, they aired TTTT with Robin Ward at
this slot as well....

[uncamark]

[quote name=\'SRIV94\' date=\'Sep 15 2005, 02:30 PM\']As an aside, WBBM never ran the full hour FFC eps; they only ran the second half-hour (after TPiR).

Or were you not talking to me? 

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At this point, I'm not really sure.  

[Ian Wallis]

If they could make more money and pull better numbers from that than the network compensation fee and maybe a minute of ad time within the show, there was no choice.

Just wanted to bump this up to ask one more thing about this:  were the networks at all concerned when affiliates started pre-empting programming?  Is there any way the networks could have made it more lucrative for an affiliate to carry their programming rather than a syndicated show, or were they at the limit - i.e. is there only so far the networks can go with this and still make a profit themselves?

I guess this question could also apply to today's daytime schedules as well.  Any thoughts?

[bellbm]

I remember once when I spoke to the progmam director in Eastern Iowa at KWWL NBC, he told me that they love game shows and they perform very well.  Therefore, we rarely had any pre-emptions of the NBC line up.  The only thing they did was flip flop Wheel of Fortune and whatever game aired at 11:30 CST.  I guess WOF was a better lead in for their noon news than Wordplay.

[chris319]

Your nomenclature is all messed up. A pre-emption is when an episode of Card Sharks isn't shown because Reagan was shot, or because of local news coverage. Either the network or a local station can pre-empt a show. Not clearing a show means a local station's management has decided that you're not going to see the next n weeks of Card Sharks and will see Donahue instead. The clearance level, along with the national ratings, are taken into account when deciding to renew a show.

Also, I am unaware of pilots being fed to stations for their approval in clearing a show. In the case of our show the "pilot" was taped the Friday before the debut, too late to feed to affiliates for their approval. Pilots were tested by the networks but affiliates were not involved.

[trainman]

[quote name=\'bellbm\' date=\'Sep 19 2005, 08:47 AM\']I remember once when I spoke to the progmam director in Eastern Iowa at KWWL NBC, he told me that they love game shows and they perform very well.  Therefore, we rarely had any pre-emptions of the NBC line up.

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I have very vivid memories of watching "Super Password" on KWWL during visits to my grandparents in the Iowa City area (it wasn't cleared in Tampa, so getting to see it was a rare treat).  I remember KWWL's station IDs back in those days, with video of the water towers of communities in their coverage area.

[chris319]

I remember KWWL's station IDs back in those days, with video of the water towers of communities in their coverage area.

Those were actually al Qaeda training videos.

[BobbyLankford_83]

Here is my info on pre-emptions thru the years:

In Michigan , our CBS station WKZO-TV (now WWMT) Kalamazoo carried every CBS game show, including the original Password (they also aired the color reruns from 1967-70,before ABC revived Password), TJW, TPIR and MG. The Lansing CBS station, WJIM-TV (now WLNS) usually bumped Tattletales ,both versions except for a time when it aired at 11am in 1975 and later the last  1 1/2 years of MG'77/'78/'79 were not aired and Body Language wasn't aired on WLNS and neither was the last PYL's in 1986.

WOOD -TV 8 NBC Grand Rapids did not air the 12:30 or 1:30 NBC shows due to local news and Merv Griffin before he moved to CBS to face Carson, or the original MG. In the 1970's and 1980's they bumped various shows including The Gong Show,(although WOOD did air the night version), MGHS and SP.

WILX-TV Lansing bumped the NBC AM game shows from 1959-70. I know Matt Ottinger remembers that like I do, because of WILX's shared time arrangement with WKAR-TV (then WMSB)Michigan State University's NET/PBS station on Channel 10 from 3/1959-9/1972. So they signed on at 7am with The Today Show and then at 9am WMSB came on with local and NET/PBS shows like Mr. Rogers and Sesame Street then back to WILX for NBC's soaps and also for You Don't Say and the original MG and various syndie shows and later the local and NBC news and then back to WMSB and tehn back to WILX for NBC shows like Laugh-In or Jeannie and then sign off after Johnny Carson. There were no games on 10 from NBC from 9/1969 when YDS and the original MG were canned until the summer of 1970 when the original Concentration, Hollywood Squares and Jeopardy! were on a tape delay from 3-4:30 when Mike Douglas came on,but the original $OTC with Jack Kelly and later Joe Garagiola was not seen in Lansing until 9/1972,and The Who, What or Where Game with Art James was also not seen on WILX until 9/1972. The shared-time  deal ended on 9/10/1972 when WILX went Full-Time NBC and WKAR-TV came back on 23. WILX carried all of NBC's games until 1979 when the new version of J! with Art Fleming moved in at noon, but Action News aired at the time, and the last year of Perry CS was not aired and neither was the last five months of P+(I would see them later on GSN). And I never got to see Just Men ! on WILX or WOOD due to news. Can someone tell me if that show still exists? I'd love to see GSn air it.

WJRT-TV Flint carried virtually all of ABC's shows, WZZM -TV Grand Rapids tape delayed Password and later Family Feud due to Eyewitness news, and WUHQ-TV (now WOTV) Battle Creek aired all of ABC's games as scheduled.


Then in 1983, I moved to Sacramento and here's the scoop on lineups here:

When I got here KCRA 3 aired WOF at 10 am, then TTD, and then The New Battlestars, which left the air a few weeks after I moved, and Dream House  on a tape delay took over, but GO! came in October, bumping DH, and $OTC was on a tape delay due to a local talk show called Look Who's Talking . We also never got to see Your Number's UP or Time Machine. KCRA did air Hot Potato and SP and also aired Fantasy and later MGHS on a one-week tape delay. We did not see the last episodes of MGHS in the summer of 1984 because KCRA wanted to do an afternoon version of Look Who's Talking,but it flopped.

Later , KCRA bumped CC but got it in 9/1989, and also bumped the last  1 1/2 years of $OTC and also Wordplay (Wordplay and CC were on what's now My58 in 1987,), and also TTTT90.


KXTV 10 carried all of the CBS games but in the early 1990's bumped TPIR, but public outcry reinstated TPIR. Now KXTV is ABC and when the Kings are on they often send J! to 1am and no WOF. At least I get WSBK Boston on Dish Network so I won't have to worry about pre-emptions.

KOVR 13 had many of the ABC games, but did not air MG90-91. I watched MG 90-91 on KGO in San Francisco on cable. KOVR is now CBS.

KDWB 20 in San Francisco (then KOFY TV 20) had many of the CBS and NBC games bumped by KPIX CBS 5 and KRON 4 , when they were with NBC in the 1970's and 1980's including, TPIR, PYL, CS-Eubanks, CC, BL, Fantasy,$25K Pyramid among others. Later KPIX began airing TPIR and KRON (which lost NBC to KNTV 11 and is now My TV 4 in the Bay Area) began airing CC.

[chrispw1]

I grew up in Chicago area and had relatives from milwaukee and Milwaukee was bad for many years with preemptions. FI can only go back to the early 80s but WITI 6 didn't seem to have any game shows other than Price Is Right and $25,000 Pyramid at 8am central only starting in 1986 or so. They never had Child's Play, Body Language, Press Your Luck, Now You See It 1989, CBS Wheel of Fortune, Combs Feud, Eubanks Card Sharks. They had Donahue at 11 am and bumped Young and the Restless to 9 am. WTMJ 4 was bad with preemptions as they never had Win Lose or Draw daytime, Hit Man, Time Machine, Your Number's Up, Wordplay, MG/HS hour, didn't have Super Password until the last year or so and for years didn't carry the daytime Wheel. They usually in the mid 80s aired reruns such as Little House on the Prarie, Magnum PI, Quincy and a few others. I don't think Milwaukee had any independents picking stuff up until the early 90s when then independednt now CBS WDJT 58 picked up Family Feud, Scattegories, Scrabble 93 and a few others, although I believe WCGV 24 may have aired some network shows in 1986 or so.

As for Chicago in 1979-80 WMAQ aired Hollywood Squares and then Password Plus at 3pm when they had 11:30 am news and they were airing Wink Martindale's  High Rollers at 10 am pushing Wheel to 3:30 pm.

[Don Howard]

One Cleveland television station decision I'll always wonder about is the early 1987 removal of The $25,000 Pyramid so then-CBS affiliate WJW-TV 8 could present reruns of Maude each weekday morning at 10:00.
Dumping Card Sharks a couple of months later for The $1,000,000 Chance Of A Lifetime, however, I had no problem with.